@L-W
My bad, I was irritated at my post not showing up and rushed to post an extremely brief summary of what it originally was.

Ah, I didn’t know that the Galactic Empire was that big. I always thought of it being around the size of the Imperium of Man.

But anyways, it would be nice if L-W could provide some stats about the IoM industry.

2.2 Eclipses a day at the Kuat Drive facility eh? So how many facilities of that size do they have in SW?

uhhh, wait a second l-w, if 1 eclipse=1000 Acclamators, and 2200 Acclamators per second, thats 2.2 eclipses per second, not per day
190,080 eclipses per day=win

“Eclipse >>>>>>>>>>>>>retribution”
I pity you…I really do.

If the Imperium is using composites they would crush star wars from the word go. The Golden throne acts as a teleportation method to get anywhere they want. That Star forge? Open up a portal and throw in a melta bomb at it’s most important place. The death star? Get a void missile, and launch it into the portal. Bye death star.

“I don’t get it, was this supposed be a serious question?”

Yes it is. Especially when this guy claims that 190,080 eclipses can be made per day.

“Yes it is. Especially when this guy claims that 190,080 eclipses can be made per day.”

I suggest you not take him seriously or posses the reprehension of associating myself with him by fiat.

But in reality there are at least half a dozen logical and rather obvious reasons you don’t mass produce the largest ship available to any fleet en masse despite present industrial facilities possessing the capacity.

Political expediency: Do you want to piss off external and internal political entities?

Commercial: Flooding a market has a negative effect on a judicial economy such as the Empire.

Employment: Massive military industrialization has a negative effect on economy value by drastically decreasing unemployment, causing off the charts inflation.

Logistical: Larger vessels require massive crews, which in themselves require massive supplies including fuel; how would fuel be distributed across a fleet of massive city sized vessels when the Empire already has a Galaxy wide fleet of millions of smaller vessels to maintain.

Force strength ratio: Conquering a planet from an enemy requires massive fleets of dedicated vessels, whereas basic patrols, escort, rescue, scouting or disaster relief operations (the standard MO of almost every military) would demand far more finesse and specially dedicated craft.

What? Did you expect the US to pump out a dozen Aircraft Carriers in the event of Hurricane Katrina? Do we send out every Marine in the military to secure a downed Chopper? Any force, regardless of how muscular, still requires the correct application; otherwise you risk falling flat on your face.

Efficiency: Is a 100,000 strong navy of SSD’s necessary when not at war when a smaller and more mobile force would be far more efficient and at least sufficient for the job.

Dont know where it said that tyranids blocked the light of most of the universe. Your not thinking of the Astronomicon are you? The 40k “universe” has most factions based in the milky way galaxy, with the tyranids coming from another galaxy which they likely devoured and chaos coming from the warp. So we have one galaxy occupied by eldar, orks, tau, necrons and humans, another filled with nids and an entire dimension controlled by chaos. Hope that helps.
Oh Panzer chew on this. Alpha level Psyker. These beings are able to snap a battle titan in half with a flick of their wrist, drive an entire army insane with a single word and summon a legion of Greater Daemons. Lets see Palpatine top that!

“Dont know where it said that tyranids blocked the light of most of the universe. Your not thinking of the Astronomicon are you?”

Possibly their “Shadows of the Warp” abilty, which screws over the “lights” of the Astronomicon?

i just don’t get how people expect the republic to wage war on a galactic scale with less soldiers than it has planets

The Republic had under her control somewhere in the order of one to twelve million planets, meaning that to wage an effective Galaxy wide war, each Trooper in Traviss’s Grand Army of the Republic would have to be garrisoned on four separate planets at once; this doesn’t include the millions of vessels in the fleet and every outpost, base, station and orbital gangway between Kamino to Coruscant.

I’d like to see how star wars universe would respond to having chaos slowly turning it againist itself, while being consumed by tyranids, overwhelmed with orks, atomized by necrons, blindsided by the Eldar, out teched by the Tau, and then to top this dream float of you’re fucked having every-single-assest of the IOM appear on the horizon…….. with their black hole torpedos already loaded.

eldar and tau are too few/young (respectively) to not get curb-stomped by the GE
i dont know much about the ork navy. does anyone have stats about it?
IoM gets its agri- and forge worlds BDZd in short order.
if someone can quantify the necron’s and tyranid’s ship stats, it would be very helpful for the debate.

Here is a list of tyranid ships
http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Bio-ships#Deathburner_Kraken
and here is a list of necron ships
http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Necron_Fleet

Any move made by the GE will be forseen by the eldar and necrons can immdeiatly intercept and destroy them. Meanwhile youll have multiple Imperial battle fleets showing up and simply blowing apart any world they encounter. Whatever garrison force the GE has will be tied up with the multiple hive fleets devouring multiple worlds while the unified orks launch the biggest WAAAAAGGGGHHHH of all time against anything left standing.

“Being “small” in the WH40k universe is a very large misdemeanor.”
small compared to the IoM? then they are utterly insignificant compared to the empire. how many planets do they have?
“Any move made by the GE will be forseen by the eldar and necrons can immdeiatly intercept and destroy them”
i could theoretically foresee a planetoid impacting earth tomorrow. i can’t do anything about it. even so, how could they stop and intercept a fleet moving orders of magnitude faster than them and possessing many more ships than them?
“hey pretty much teleport anywhere they want to before even you can blink!”
and run into a planetary shield generator than will hold off months of teraton level blasts

That comment about planetry shield amuses me greatly. The WH 40k has such shields protecting their own ships I beileve and the necron, IOM, eldar, chaos, etc. would only have to teleport a few troops in and destroy the generators… and then basically spin a wheel to choose the method of destruction. ” i could theoretically foresee a planetoid impacting earth tomorrow. i can’t do anything about it.”- Wow…. that really relates to a military force predicting enemy movement and acting in responce. 2 points for a example that is quite moronic.

@Panzer

“also, i’d suspect the nid’s would be vulnerable to the various diseases and bio-specific weapons of star wars”

bwahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!
Oh my ribs!

I like how PANZER picks facts to believe and the ignores the rest of them, this is almost as funny as watching Caboose try to not team kill.

“would only have to teleport a few troops in and destroy the generators… and then basically spin a wheel to choose the method of destruction.” if its that easy, why even have the extra expense of shield if they can just teleport through? why teleport troops through as opposed to explosives? either they don’t have this ability, or their tacticians are cataclysmically retarded.
“- Wow…. that really relates to a military force predicting enemy movement and acting in responce. 2 points for a example that is quite moronic.”
i’m merely saying how can they act in response when they lack the means to do such in the limited amount of time before the imperial fleet arrives and turns the planet to slag

“i am entirely aware of how fast they are. its just that they would get bogged down in laying siege to shielded planets.”

Shielded planets? *Necron ships phase out of reality, fly through shields, phase back*

That or if the C’Tan Deceiver God is around, he could simply transform into Emperor Palpatine or some other high ranking person and order all shielding to be shut down.

“and run into a planetary shield generator than will hold off months of teraton level blasts”

A Necron ship unleashes petatons in a single shot. I doubt a fleet of Necron ships would have much trouble with most planetary shielding if for some reason they wanted to take them out. Then there’s the Necron World Engines. Those should be fun!

Necron Gauss weapons IGNORE all known types of shields. The Necron cruisers (Yes, the escorts) Have taken Plenty of Torpedoes measuring in the petaton range.

The world engine….I think that is a bit ruthless for Star wars. I mean, A Death star the size of a PLANET that has shields that take MONTHS to take out with Cyclonic torpedoes…(The ones that blow up planets in one shot) and is covered with gauss cannons, and jamming devices, can travel at the speed on infinitey and can make a planet not exist anymore in one shot….

Yeah…

Goood. GOOOOOooood. Let the hate flow through you!

You wouldn’t even scratch the paint Baron.

Sorry for the rants everyone…I’ve been kinda angry lately…have no idea why…

Time to break out the minature Sarlaac in order to ease myself…

Time to bring out the World engine…Win.

Yeah Panzer…you’re seriously underestimating WH40k and overestimating SW.

Since you were talking about space battles, L-W pointed out in Battleship vs SSD:

“Giving the blast of a Nova cannon (The most powerful ship mounted Imperial weapon) a staggering yield of 22 petatons. For those of you struggling to comprehend these figures, this is a yield one million times greater than the heaviest Turbolaser available to the Star Wars universe.

Or for those less fantastically inclined, two to three million times the combined explosive power of every nuclear weapon on Earth throughout history.”

“Judging from previous calculations, individual Heavy Turbolasers produce between 22-200 Gigatons, thus requiring inordinate amounts of them available to level Star Destroyer shields. A tad bit insufficient to deal with 40K void shielding, but powerful when massed.”

“how well do you think the nova cannon would compare to the eclipse superlaser, which has firepower in the hexaton range?”

No cause eclipse sucks because I don’t give a source saying or citing any information that may be used in the debate.

“hexaton range?”

/Facepalm

Are you seriously suggesting that a laser with enough firepower to slag entire continents generates only six tons worth of TNT per blast? Or did you mean exatons?

Either way, as I’ve already stated once on this thread and I will not fucking repeat following this post; the Empire (and every other conventional force before and after) can easily hold their own against the likes of the Imperium, the Tau, the Eldar and possibly the Tyranids for a short period of time, but throw in the likes of the Necrons (with their physics raping powers) and the battle very easily begins to favor 40K within a matter of minutes.

A fully mobilized Necron military is something that only the upper tier civilizations (Downstreamers, Culture, Xeelee etc) could contain and destroy.

- – -

“Fine, You’re in a plastic suit and Im in ceramite…Guess who wins?”

That’s an eschewed comparison since your essentially comparing bog standard infantry body armour to heavy Tank/Upper percentile super-soldier composite plating. If you want to be fair, try comparing it to Doonium, Phrik or Neutronium.

“If you want to be fair, try comparing it to Doonium, Phrik or Neutronium.”
But I don’t like being fair….:D
If you want, you should post that in Alternate battles in Factpile topia.

We didn’t even need Gods…

““hexaton range?”
/Facepalm”
sorry, finger slipped

“and isn’t the main necron host still asleep?”

They are actually collaborating on a project known as the “Great Warding”, in which they plan to isolate the Galaxy from the Warp due to the fact that the C’tan are incredibly vulnerable to immaterial based entities and energies thanks to the meddling of the Great Old Ones.

The moment they signal the all clear, billions of Necron troops are going to pour out from their Tombs and harvest all life in the universe.

“A fully mobilized Necron military is something that only the upper tier civilizations (Downstreamers, Culture, Xeelee etc) could contain and destroy.”
just wondering, could the nids in their untold quintillions defeat them?

1) “L-W, are you refering to the same type of devices located on Cadia or all new, uber powerful necron devices?”

The Cadian Pylons are essentially giant Gellar Field generators, designed to repel Warp energies and suppress the Eye of Terror. The source of the Great Warding currently remains unknown, but it is postulated to form from within the Dyson Sphere at the behest of the trapped C’tan.

2) “just wondering, could the nids in their untold quintillions defeat them?”

In my opinion Games Workshop will devise a method of both factions neutralizing one another before any great conflict could destroy the Galaxy. After all, it’s not exactly economically viable to destroy their entire stock of merchandise and alienate thousands of fans, is it?

3) “Billions? just a few billion Necron think they can take over the entire universe?”

Possibly trillions depending on how far the war in Heaven escalated before the C’tan took part.

Although with inertialess drives, mathematically imaginary mass generators, particle stripping weapons, teleportation, the capacity to phase through any and every material construct and the ability to physically recover any and all Necron troops in the Galaxy from just a puddle of molten metal, the only reason the entirety of existence has yet to be monstrously fed to hungry Star Gods is due to the fact that Games Workshop has yet to commit financial suicide.

Necrons are the most interesting thing about Warhammer 40K, they remind me of less powerful Daleks.

So it’s settled that WH40k wins against Star Wars once again?

On a side note, I’m just curious about these numbers as i was searching the web for the capabilities of Star Wars ships…and stumbled upon this:
http://forums.spacebattles.com/showthread.php?t=123502
basically, a Eclipse superlaser emits 239 petatons? o_O

Oh, and this:
http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?style=4&f=2&t=70265&start=0
60 BILLION TRILLION petatons!?

L-W, are these numbers actually correct? (mainly the first…the second seems rediculously overpowered?).

Oh…one more thing…this doesn’t seem right, does it?
http://img4.imageshack.us/i/stardestroyerdivineinte.gif/

wow, comparing one side’s basic patrol boat to another sides command ship
brilliant

“wow, comparing one side’s basic patrol boat to another sides command ship”

A Star Destroyer is not a basic patrol boat. It is a cruiser type ship.

How does it seem off?

60 billion trillion petaton? WHAT!? There’s no way in hell any ship with anything
that resemble numbers can have such firepower. No way, they wouldn’t need the Death Star. Perhaps
something in the fleet may dish it out, but that must be limited to less than 5 vessels,
otherwise they would just destroy everything opposing them.