awesome anyway im leaning toward the necron lord for this as some of vaders force abilities will have no effect and the necron lord outpowers vader but what artefects does the necron lord have? From the pic hes got his mask,gaze of flame,upgraded staff of light/warscythe and armour?

“Raw” Strength? Darth Vader is hundreds of times weaker than the Necron. A Necron Lord is many times more powerful than a Space Marine, and Space Marine recruits are capable of lifting masses of 100 tons and more.

This means if the Necron Lord got close, he would simply rip Vader in half.
I don’t know if the light saber would be able to slice through the Necrons material.

Even if the Lord was in pieces, over time he would put his shit back together.

And I’m pretty sure a gauss shot is faster than Vaders “Thought”.
Vader won’t know what the fuck is going on.

“It may be able to withstand a few gauss shots…maybe being the keyword.”

His suit would not survive a glancing blow. Even the weakest Gauss weapons are capable of punching holes through Terminator armor with not much trouble.

going with the necron lord on this one.

i highly doubt vader can defend himself against gauss weaponry and what artifacts does the lord have?also the necron lord can surprise vader since a lord can teleport (they can in the WH40K games dunno on tabletop)

how strong a lightsaber is against the necron metal i dont know. i do know that even a simple necron soldier needs alot of punishment to be taken down only to repair himself moments later.

question to people with knowledge about necrons: dont necrons disturb any form of magic/kinitic power?? im more of a chaos guy but i thought i readed something about the necrons have negative influence on the warp?

Wait, Should the Lord be able to be tossed around? The force is in “Living things” And The necron lord is also a “Pariah” So…I don’t think vader could use the force to directly attack the lord.

@Space Marine

But if Vader manage to cut the Necron Lord in half, the Necron Lord will be just like you…

Necron Lords (at least in Dark Crusade) can phase out of reality. I’m pretty sure that the Force can’t hit things that aren’t really there.

My take (assuming a DOW-esque Necron Lord):
Necron Lord phases out to avoid attacks, teleports to an advantageous position, and proceeds to flay Vader (whether by Gauss or melee).
Essence of a patron C’tan would be overkill.

Also, I think that Space Marine is implying that, assuming the Necron Lord is a Pariah (though if I’m not mistaken, Pariahs are converted humans), it is essentially a “Blank,” as in, it is not only immune to but also dampens and even nullifies psychic abilities. However, this is problematic since the Force is not necessarily the Warp. How such two forces interact really can’t be known.
It would really suck for Vader if Pariah abilities affected the Force.

“Wait, Should the Lord be able to be tossed around? The force is in “Living things” And The necron lord is also a “Pariah” So…I don’t think vader could use the force to directly attack the lord.”

“I don’t see why not. Lightsabers, attack droids and star destroyers can be effected, why not other unliving things?”

“Also, I think that Space Marine is implying that, assuming the Necron Lord is a Pariah (though if I’m not mistaken, Pariahs are converted humans), it is essentially a “Blank,” as in, it is not only immune to but also dampens and even nullifies psychic abilities. However, this is problematic since the Force is not necessarily the Warp. How such two forces interact really can’t be known.
It would really suck for Vader if Pariah abilities affected the Force.”

I do believe that Vader would be completly unable to directly affect the Necron Lord using the Force. See Yuuzhan Vong:

Perhaps the most notable and most objectionable trait of the Yuuzhan Vong was that they were outside the Force as the Jedi knew it. They had no Force presence that could be sensed, and were unaffected by most Force powers that were targeted directly at them. This meant that any attempt to sense their motivation, truthfulness or determine their next course of action were futile though it did mean that one was capable of detecting them by reaching out in the Force and determining if the person had no presence within it.[9] Even a normally powerful telekinetic blast that was capable of pasting an ordinary opponent across the wall simply caused a Yuuzhan Vong either to fall down or lose balance temporarily.[10] Whilst it was not possible to affect the Yuuzhan Vong directly through the use of the Force, it was possible to use indirect means to accomplish such a task such as manipulating a stone through telekinesis and throwing it at a Yuuzhan Vong which would still hurt them or by controlling the air in an attempt to increase the pressure thus allowing a Jedi to in effect crush the Yuuzhan Vong.[9] The only known Force techniques that seemed somehow exempt from this limitation were variations on Force lightning.

Sounds kinda familiar doesn’t it?

…Did this thread die so quickly? Or is LW and someone going at it on another part of the site in such an epic, and futile battle of wit that we are all held hostage to our desire for mental anguish?

@sinm

Boba fett also used a laser weapon, as opposed to Gauss technology, which strips the atoms of a target one layer at a time. If you are going to bring up examples, please do us the favor of pointing out how these examples are worthwhile.

This should be a win for the Necron Lord. Vader hasn’t got a chance in hell of stopping Gauss weaponry, and he never showed the ability or will to do things like melting people/droids from the inside with the force, which is the only way he’ll be able to stop the Lord. The lightsaber could more than likely do a number on the lord, but Vader will be free-floating atoms before he gets the chance. And that’s just a basic lord.

“yeah I’m going with the Lord here. I dont know about the one in the tabletop game, but in DOW the lord can turn into the Nightbringer-a god I think. Either way he can’t be KILLED. It deserved caps.”

No, they can’t turn into the Nightbringer. I never understood why Dark Crusade had that. The lord sure as hell doesn’t need to turn into a C’tan to win this though. Basic Gauss Flayer weapons punch through steel walls as if they weren’t there, and rip apart Space Marines in one shot. The Lord’s staff of light is even more powerful than an Immortals Gauss Blaster.

And Necron Lords are not Pariahs. Pariahs are humans with the pariah gene, which gives them a negative impact on the warp. Necrons simply have no soul to speak of whatsoever.

“Come on! Vader has his own theme music!” So does Kharn, although it’s death metal http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DkkYxmMj-Oo&feature=related

“Buuuuut… How strong is vader’s suit? It may be able to withstand a few gauss shots…maybe being the keyword.”

No, just no. Space Marines can wade through molten metal, and take lasgun shots (By most calculations, equal to or greater than blaster shots) like they were light rain. Gauss flayers punch straight through power armour in most novels.

And the pain it may cause…pssh,aren’t jedi MASTERS trained to deal with pain and not lose concentration? Besides,hasnt vader also had his legs chopped the flurp off and then dipped in a bit o’ magma? So,ya,he’s not new to extreme pain(and isn’t he now part machine…i.e immune to pain but can sense damage?).”

*Sigh*
It’s not so much the pain that will stop him fighting back so much as the fact he will be rendered into free atoms.

“Also,what tempratures do a lightsabres produce and at what tempratures does necron armor melt? With these bits of info,mayhap ol’ darthy may chop his way through before being impaled/flayed/torn apart at the hands of ancient death.”

Lightsabers will most likely be able to kill the lord, but trust me when I say that Vader isn’t going to get a chance to use his.

“P.S to admin

how about a marvel vs. Warhammer battle royal tournment ey. Goodies vs. Baddies? Im just putting it out there…kinda like a fart”

This is what the battle requests thread is for you dolt.

“In the Caiphas Cain novels the necrons do get harmed by laser (hellguns), with the shot atomising the directly hiy part of the necron and softening the metal around the wound. So im thinking that a lightsaber would make short work of necrons.”

We are all aware that a lightsaber would probably kill a Lord. However, one shot from the Lord will turn Vader into atoms, so the Lightsaber isn’t much of a factor here.

“This is how i see the fight going.
Lord fires a shot and due to his precog, vader dodges it. If they closed i’m pretty sure darth could cut up the lords staff and kill him.
But if the lord gets iff another shot then vader is dead, no question about it. Also the lord could easily regenerate from being cut up. I’m gonna say vader wins this one”

He dodges it. A beam that travels at the speed of light aimed by a goddam Necron lord. Do you not see the problem here? Precog or no precog, Vader has a snowballs chance in hell of actually dodging the SoL. What’s more, it’s rapid fire. So no, Vader does not win.

The Gauss weaponry, Vader might be able to block. Lightsabers can block Lasers…. so I have to give it to Darth. He’s taken worse pain, as if in having his legs chopped off, and being dipped in a little lava….. If It strips it Atom by atom, couldn’t it be thrown back at the Lord by the force? That would be something new for the lord.
So, It comes down to the powers of the force. If you can make Lighting come out of your hand, with no friction because your gloves are leather, well……. He created lighting out of air. I’m not good with science, but from what I understand, that’s pretty impossible to do.

@ Kenny C

OOOHHHH, Lord has a Gauss rifle! 4 words: Deflected back at him.

@ Kenny C

They’ve thrown Lightsabers, picked up cans, thrown them , then they got caught and someone threw it back…. I think they could turn it around. They could use the force push…. It pushes back anything i n their way.

@ Kenny C

Then what would be the point of this debate? You guys are saying that the Lord can Beat Vader, but you never do…… You set yourself up.

@ Kenny C

- Maybe, but It’s 3 am here and I’m almost falling asleep on my keyboard

-That will never be proven,

-I know that.

@ Kenny C

- Today is my last day to stay up late before school….. My parents said I could stay up as late as I could.

-That stinks. But, Vader might get lucky, if they were to re-spawn, and throw his saber, and catch him off guard, or something like that. So, It will never be proven.

Vader cannot use force lightning without killing himself. It’d short out his armor.

The Force crush may not work, but the sheer pressure could stop the Lord from moving. He could lift it into the air and hold it still while carving it up. He could rip the guass weapon from its hands and fire it without touching the trigger.

Depending on certain things, Vader could absorb the gauss blasts like he does with blaster shots (with the Force), or deflect it with his lightsaber. I doubt it, but the possibility is there.

With precognition, he could be out of the way before the gauss flayer fires. Vader has a chance here.

Vader has stopped lightning attacks with his saber…li fuckin’ ghtning…that shit is hot,fast and not exactly tangible…

Question. Can vader block gauss shots? If he can,then he could try and hold the Lord down while advancing and chop chop chop…all he has to hope for is that the Lord don’t phase out and rip his guts out

Agreed. Necron Lord FTW.

+1 Nomination for the Necron.

“Question. Can vader block gauss shots? If he can,then he could try and hold the Lord down while advancing and chop chop chop…all he has to hope for is that the Lord don’t phase out and rip his guts out”

I think we would need a physics expert to answer that, but my guess is that it won’t work the same way.

Gauss tech actually PULLS molecules from the target. It stands to reason that the energy beam itself might be ripped appart by the Gauss weapon. If the energy is unafected by the attack, the “handle” device sure won’t be.

Bottom line is no, I don’t think Vader has any way of blocking the Gauss attacks with his lightsaber.

“I think we would need a physics expert to answer that, but my guess is that it won’t work the same way.”

*Wakes up*

What? Hello? Who said that?

*Puts on nerd glasses*

According to literature the lightsaber produces an arc of energy that contacts at both ends along the hilt, creating a steady thrumming passage of energy between two separate points that can safely be handled without the excess heat of the plasma sheath causing third degree burns in bare handed users. When the saber comes into contact with a substance denser than water (such as an alloy), the arc is partially broken, causing sheath to partially weaken and the beam to react violently as it releases the energy necessary to cut through large swathes of denser materials.

In the case of the Gauss rifle, whilst it may or may not be blocked by the lightsaber, contacting and breaking the arc of the lightsaber could possibly cause it to react violently, or short out entirely if the sheath dissipates all together.

“so whats stopping him from doing those things i listed above?”

Simple answer?

Phase Shifter.

Complex answer?

Necrodermis, plus Phase Shifter, plus Phylactery, plus Resurection Orb, but only AFTER Vader supresses the paralyzing horror from Gaze of Flame, plus Nightmare Shroud, and gets a fix on the Lord using Veil of Darkness, plus Chronometron, plus Solar Pulse…

Vader is a dreadful Sith Lord, no doubt about it, but Necron Lords are some of the more horrifying beings to walk the worlds of 40K. The Necrodermis alone is comparable (if not stronger) than 40K’s Adamantium. I have a hard time beleiving any of Vader’s attacks, conventional or Force-powered, could damage the Lord’s Necrodermis in the first place. As if that wasn’t enough, the technology repairs itself in seconds.

In addition, a Lord can have Phylactery (essentially Necron nanites) to hold the Necrodermis together if it DOES get damaged while the substance repairs itself, and he could also have a Resurection Orb on top of that to completely reverse damage at a molecular level.

Necron Lords are essentialy the result of throwing Wolverine, a T-1000, Apocalypse, and a countless millenia-old arch lich into a melting pot. I really don’t see how Vader can survive this.

Well considering that space marines have no fear and IG storm troopers have no fear yet they are paralysed in fright when exposed to pariahs and the ‘skully mask’ I dont think Vader is gonna be able to attack much less hold his bladder.
Can a lightsaber even damage necrodermis? Considering it usually takes a shot from a plasma gun, which supposedly unleashes the heat of a star on the target, to put down a basic necron soldier Im doubtful. Does a lightsaber generate anywhere near that heat?

“and yes it would…”

What is the basis of this conclussion?

Sapper007, just stop. Your last arguments were absolutely hilarious, and that’s not positive. The Force won’t help against the barrage a Necron Lord can unleash, a lightsaber will probably not deal any real damage at all and the Necron is probably far more horrifying in cc too. This one is a no-brainer, Vader fights way outta his own league here.

Okay. This Necron Lord has no equipment. WIth the veil of darkness and rez orb, he can get back up all the time, even against a lightsaber which I classify as a power weapon from the tabletop game. The veil of darkness allows him to freaking teleport!!! Also the staff of light shoots three rapid fire shots, and allows him still to charge into close combat because it is classified as an Assault Three weapon. The gauss blasts flay apart anything in their path, move faster than light, and can pass through the heaviest armor.

Also, Vader supposedly can’t use lightning anymore because of his armor. He was only able to before becoming Vader.

Vader is screwed no contest.

Baron Sombody posted: “How tall exactly is the Necron Lord? Until I find out I won’t say what I think but from what Space Marine has told me if a Necron gets cut apart they just reassemble instantly”

Now I saw someone give you an answer already, but I was too lazy to read the other 65 comments, and this page isn’t very old so I will give me 2 cents.

It depends on the Necron Lord, The one from Dark Crusade is easily 10-12 feet tall I would bet the Sox sweep the Cubs on it. (I like both teams but I PREFER the Sox thats all) A Necron Lord (the one no bigger than a warrior) could be from 7″5′ to 9″ but if it is the Immortal Necron Lord, I bet 9 or 10 feet tall.

Does that answer your question?

Necron Lord for the win