This would be an elongated fight, but I’m pretty sure the force has this one handled. Even if the marine manages to somehow get close Vaders lightsaber could cut him to pieces.

Ya this would probably last awhile because I mean that guy (whoever he is) isn’t Xena or anything and his armor looks pretty strong so I’ll give him that…but Vader would probably rip him in half with the force

@Galen Marek

Indeed. I am also leaning towards Vader, but those details still irk me. For example. In the tabletop game, Terminator Armour grants exceptional protection over any conventional attack, shrugging off most everything. In addition, the armour’s properties also grant protection over other supernatural/meta-science attacks at a slightly lesser effectiveness. Meaning that I still beleive the Lightsaber, as well as other force attacks, will have a hard time getting through.

A good strategy vader could employ is to throw the saber and “animate” it with the force, staying well away from the behemoth. However, this could also be negated by the Chapter Master laying Bolter fire on vader. At the very least, this could break vader’s concentration to effectively control the saber. Hitting mostly hot air.

Should Calgar even graze vader, thats it folks, game over. The Gauntlets are able to rip through 40k’s Land Raiders and Monolyths. Im pretty sure vader’s feble armor would crumble under his grip as if it was a sheet of aluminum foil.

Also, Space Marines of this caliber have fighting prowess that equals or even surpass most Jedi. Vader is still Vader, still has the advantage with a lighter weapon, but calgar is no pushover in hand to hand combat.

Another thing of note is that those fists double his already massive strength. In all essense, Vader is fighting a Hulk with many more combat skills. Again, I still think Vader pulls the win, but its a pretty even match.

Come to think of it, that sounds like a fair match. I think Calgar matches Hulk in strength, speed, and invulnerability.

i bet even superman couldnt take a lightsaber…but nobody pwns darth vader…except luke

@AlphaCommando – “Also; I would rate pure adamantium (40K style) as fairly lightsaber resistant, even without the conversion fields….”

Well, the Tactical Dreadnought Armour is not made entirely of Adamantium, It has an Adamantium frame. It is a wild combination of Ceramite, Plasteel, and Adamantium. you can bet your ass this bad boy is Lightsaber resistant. Mind you, resistant.

I think Calgar’s Iron Halo might further seal the deal against Vader’s saber and Force attacks. I had initially not taken this piece into account because he is not allowed to wear it in table games while he has the Terminator Armour, but now I think that was more for game balance issues. Just as his model shows, he still wields it. With it, combined with the amazin arour, im pretty certain now he is nigh invulnerable.

Vader could still put a few good Saber hits in, tho. Still a toss in my mind, but no longer favoring Vader.

Heres a link to Calgar’s model:
http://www.coolminiornot.com/pics/pics8/img430baf2015fb3.jpg

also…if darth vader could (possibly) rip apart ships wouldnt he do the same to this guy?

im pretty sure he could as he can stop people’s hearts

id agree with you but alas the force is unavoidable even with the most highly powered armor…say a root doctor guy places a hex on someone that makes them die…armor wont protect them from that so its the same thing

A couple points of clarification: first and foremost, Calgar’s armor is not the bulky, unwieldly terminator armor, it is artificer armor. That is, armor that is as light as normal power armor but provides the same protection OR BETTER than terminator armor. Id est, Calgar can move with the same blinding quickness, if not faster, than a normal space marine which, as has already been established, is significantly faster than an unaugmented human eye can even see. Second, still on his armor, the gauntlets of Ultramar are completely impervious to every single type of energy or cutting tool or weapon in the entire 40k universe. Read the codex. Third, while it never explicitly states Lord Marneus Augustus Calgar’s age, it can be estimated at around at least 400 and perhaps into the seventh century of life, all the while fighting the most horrendous enemies the warp can spawn. The man is a combat powerhouse with more experience than the emperor and vader and any two other Darth anything combined. Truth be told, he is such a mighty engine of destruction, that he probably hasn’t even been considered human for almost a millennium. Fourth, If vader actually managed to get around the iron halo that Calgar wears, and all of his seals warding against any type of supernatural tele empathic invasion of any sort, then calgar could surely shrug off any choking long enough to reduce vader to a pink mist with his bolters, firing 6-10 rounds a second between the two of them. Oh, also, he has two windpipes. All ultramarines do. If Vader crushes one, Calgar will use another for at least long enough to pull all of Vader’s limbs off and bend his head around to choke him out with his own butt cheeks.

The force isn’t so much supernatural (which conjures up the concept of magic) but the ability of a force user to manipulate the energy that lives in all things, both his own and all those around him. So really; purity seals nor the Iron halo would protect Marneus. I think it comes to how each plays it; if Vader even attempted to engage Marneus in close combat he would be pulped, however Vaders force powers are considerable and he might just win if he stayed out of arm’s reach….

Either way, someone needs to animate this battle….

@GEOM – “Calgar’s armor is not the bulky, unwieldly terminator armor, it is artificer armor. That is, armor that is as light as normal power armor but provides the same protection OR BETTER than terminator armor.”

Not 100% true. Calgar is unique in 40k in terms of armour because he has both. He has been seen in recent battles on both machina. Further, he has recently donned his Terminator Armour more often than his Artificer. To top that off, unless im totally mistaken, the armour depicted on the art above is his Terminator Armour.

“Second, still on his armor, the gauntlets of Ultramar are completely impervious to every single type of energy or cutting tool or weapon in the entire 40k universe. Read the codex.”

Yes, I agree, and tried to illustrate that point before.

“The man is a combat powerhouse with more experience than the emperor and vader and any two other Darth anything combined. Truth be told, he is such a mighty engine of destruction, that he probably hasn’t even been considered human for almost a millennium.”

He did manage to get pwned by the Tyranid wave that claimed most of his body. Like Vader, he is mainly machine now.

“Fourth, If vader actually managed to get around the iron halo that Calgar wears, and all of his seals warding against any type of supernatural tele empathic invasion of any sort, then calgar could surely shrug off any choking long enough to reduce vader to a pink mist with his bolters, firing 6-10 rounds a second between the two of them.”

Yes, agree. I beleive hium to be immune to Force powers, or at the very least HIGHLY resistant. Others dont see this point the same way.

“Oh, also, he has two windpipes. All ultramarines do. If Vader crushes one, Calgar will use another for at least long enough to pull all of Vader’s limbs off and bend his head around to choke him out with his own butt cheeks.”

Most people are not aware of the additional organs that are inplanted into a marine throughout his “training”. Im not aware of a FULL secondary trachea, but you may be refering to the Multi-lung:

1 – Secondary Heart – This is the first and least difficult implant to install. The Secondary Heart increases blood supply and pumping capacity and is capable of taking over entirely should the primary heart fail.
2 – Ossmudula – This implant strengthens the skeleton of a Space Marine by inducing the bones to absorb a ceramic-based substance administered in a Marine’s diet. Within two years after the surgery, the Marine’s skeleton will be larger and exponentially stronger; and the rib cage will be fused into a solid bone plate.
3 – Biscopea – Implanted into the chest cavity, this implant massively bolsters muscle development and density throughout the Marine’s body. This is commonly implanted at the same time as the Ossmodula.
4 – Haemastamen – Implanted into a main blood vessel, the Haemastamen alters the Marine’s blood composition to carry oxygen and nutrients more efficiently.
5 – Larraman’s Organ – This organ manufactures Larraman Cells. These serve the purpose of platelets, but act faster and more effectively. When a Marine is wounded, Larraman Cells are released, attached to leukocytes. At the site of the injury, they form scar tissue in a matter of seconds, effectively preventing massive blood loss and infection.
6 – Catalepsean Node – Implanted into the back of the brain, this implant allows a marine to not sleep, instead entering a four-hour, almost comatose trance where they “recharge”. It also allows the resting of half the brain while the other remains alert, thus removing the need for total sleep. The longest known record of any space marine going without rest while on active combat duty is 319 hours by a member of the Crimson Fists.
7 – Preomnor – The Preomnor is a decontamination chamber inside the chest cavity. It chemically analyzes ingested materials and neutralizes toxins. The Preomnor enables the Marine to eat normally inedible substances and resist poisons.
8 – Omophagea – Implanted into the spinal cord, this organ is designed to absorb information and DNA related to experience or memory. This enables the Marine to gain information, in a survival or tactical sense, simply by eating an animal indigenous to an alien world.
9 – Multi-lung – The multi-lung is a third lung, able to absorb oxygen from environments poor in oxygen. Breathing is accomplished through a sphincter in the trachea, allowing all three lungs to be used at full capacity. In toxic environments, a similar muscle closes off the normal lungs, thus oxygen is absorbed exclusively by the multi-lung which filters out poisonous elements.
10 – Occulobe – Essentially, this organ enhances a Marine’s eyesight, granting him exceptional vision and the ability to see normally in low-light environment.
11 – Lyman’s Ear – This implant renders a Marine immune to dizziness and nausea(see Cochlea), and enables a Marine to consciously filter out “white noise”.
12 – Sus-an Membrane – This implant allows a Marine to enter a catatonic or “suspended animation” state. It can allow a mortally wounded Space Marine to survive his injuries, and bring the metabolism to a standstill. The longest recorded period of this state was with Brother Silas Err of the Dark Angels for 567 years.
13 – Melanochrome – Linked to pigment cells in skin, this allows the Marine’s skin to shield him from dangerous levels of radiation.
14 – Oolitic Kidney – This organ works in conjunction with the Preomnor, filtering blood to remove toxins.
15 – Neuroglottis – This organ allows a Marine to assess a wide variety of things simply by taste. From poisons to chemicals to animals, a Marine can even track his quarry by taste alone.
16 – Mucranoid – Altering sweat glands, this organ causes the secretion an oily substance that coats the skin when neccessary, protecting it from extreme temperatures and to some extent, vacuum environments.
17 – Betcher’s Gland – Implanted into multiple locations inside a Marine’s mouth, these glands transform a Marine’s saliva into corrosive, blinding acid when triggered.
18 – Progenoid Glands – Implanted into both the neck and chest cavity, these serve to collect and cultivate the gene-seed from a Space Marine’s body, and to safeguard it for the continuity of a Chapter. The neck gland is removed upon 5 years, and the chest gland upon 10 years; both are then used to create new Space Marines.
19 – The Black Carapace – The last and possibly most important of all implants, this neuroreactive material is implanted directly under the skin in the chest area. Invasive fiber bundles then grow inward and interlink with the Marine’s own nervous system. Points pre-cut into the Carapace are effectively connection points, allowing a Marine to directly interface with his Power Armor.

The shoulder pauldrons and chest plastron are the giveaways as belonging to Mk VII power armor, albeit heavily modified. Admittedly, though, his leg armor does appear to be from a terminator suit. Further to that, a marine with centuries of experience is capable of moving and fighting in terminator armor almost as quickly as a veteran marine in normal power armor. Wasn’t it Abbaddon who managed to smoke Loken in full terminator armor? Yes, Abbaddon is hardcore, but he was just a space marine captain at that time, unblessed by the powers of Chaos. About the windpipe/multilung bit: in Dead Sky, Black Sun, Captain Ventris has his trachea severed and switches to a pianful, but functional backup. I don’t have the book in front of me, so I can’t qoute the passage. I don’t believe that Vader would have a chance at any range, regardless of his ability to deflect .75 caliber mini rockets, or push them aside with the force. There is just too much incoming ordnance; a storm of exploding metal. If he hit one with his saber, it would explode, as bolter rounds are wont to do, and I seriously doubt that he could deflect hundreds of incoming explosive rounds and still choke out Calgar. It just wouldn’t happen. If, at any time, Calgar was in range of Vader’s choke, (aside from that viewscreen choke from Episode V; if they’re on different ships, then a space marine battle barge would vaporise the Executor, but that’s another post entirely) then calgar could surely close ranks fast enough to hammer Vader before he could be choked out. How long can a marine hold his breath? 15 minutes? Finally, how old is Darth Nihilus? I don’t know that fact and would concede the point if he was at least 600.

Imperator Victrix

I think Marneus would probably win, Vader has the advantage of the force but with Marneus’ amount of experience and weapons as well as his armour i find it hard to find Vader beating him. Personally I think Vader would get owned by Old Zogwort though, heheh hed turn into a squig!

undeniably Master Calgar would win. He is above any normal man even one that wields the force. I have much faith in jedi just not against Calgar. Calgar has been alive for centuries and fought in countless crusades. Force powers grant to vader as to what is natural and part of calgars being. From descriptions based in the war hammer 40k universe Calgar is nearly 10 feet tall with enhanced bone marrow, two lungs, 2 hearts, can breath toxic fumes, his wounds heal in seconds, and for Calgar to bite a chunk out of vader he is able to see the life of vader and gain vaders memories. That’s not to mention that Calgars power nodes in his Armour are connected to his nerves and can move as if not wearing Armour at all. Master Calgar not only has his fists but if he needs to be quick he has a power sword which hes more than able to wield just as fast or faster than vader. I’m not only convinced that Calgar would win because of his physical prowess as a man, its because he is part of a universe much more vast and lethal than vader. The Universe of the year 40,000 provides a much wider variety of dangers. The Last time i checked vader has never beat down a god or a immortal at that. Master Calgar has killed many foes with pshykic abilities that more than match the force.Calgar is renown for defeating the great avatar of Khaine a blood god with uncomprehending power. How many gods has vader killed. The warhammer 40 k universe has billions of people with force like powers and Calgar has triumphed them by the hordes. In conclusion i don’t think it would be close at all vader has lived a very short life with only a percentage of calgars war experience and talents. Master Calgar has faced much more worthy adversaries.

Please read above posts for complete obliteration of what you just said.

I would like to voice my opinion about a distressing trend that I have noticed on Factpile. A couple individuals seem to feel the need to browbeat or berate or chide others based simply off of their own opinion of some letters that the victim may have posted. While I at first found it amusing, (roflcopter) I am now beginning to find it tedious. MJSC STARWARS, you seem to be a huge fan of the Star Wars universe, or, at least, Darth Vader. I accept that. I am a fan of the Warhammer 40k universe, and Marneus Calgar. I submit to you that instead of saying “Vader wins”, provide references or examples of his might. I believe, based on canon in the made up universes that we’re all discussing, that Calgar would “pull all of Vader’s limbs off and bend his head around to choke him out with his own butt cheeks.” as I posted earlier. I base this assumption off of the CANON that Calgar is over 700 and has, as previously stated and can be verified, killed millions of living things and thousands of things that are far more terrifying opponents than Vader. If you have a valid counter argument, then by all means, let us have it. If Vader can win, prove it. Please. And to all those who feel the need to belittle others, while occasionally it is fun to rib people, learn when to cut it out and get back on topic. This is a shotgun blast; you only need to care if it applies to you.

-Imperator Victrix

I still think it up for debate on wither a field that protects against energy and physical projectiles will block a semi-mystical force that permeates the very universe to the core…

Well that’s the thing, the Force at the core is not actual energy (considering it seems to pass SW energy shielding without issue). Things like force lightning would be blocked I have no doubt, but not a massive force push. Normally I would say DV might be able to rip the weapon out of his hands, however those beautiful Gauntlets of Ultramar have me stuck on that, lol.

But I see what you’re getting at, course they have only brought up Medichloreans, and from my knowledge they never actually got too deep into it because I think Lucas saw the massive flaw in bringing the damn things up (since they are almost never mentioned after Episode I). There is a lack of refutable evidence toward exactly how the force works, because I take the original trilogy at heart I see the force as the mystical entity that empowers people through Medichloreans, using them as a conduit for this divine universe-controlling force. The Force is sentient in my opinion, a sort of overruling “God” that seeks to maintain perfect balance in the universe. Course opinion and speculation mean nothing when it comes to something as abstract as the Force. But hey, for the most part I’m for Marneus beating one of the coolest villains in cinema history, but I will probably always be iffy about the Force.

calgar all the way!

i think your all forgetting how much comcentration it takes to force choke somebody calgar would blow vaders legs off before he could even get the idea to plus whats the fear factor i know if i was confronted by calgar i would crap my pants and is a lightsaber corpreal my thought was calger would just grab the lightsaber and hold it still by the blade while he pummels vader with fists that could go though the death stars armour and what would win in a fight with the death star and a battle barge?
also i hate vader and would love to see him get a chainsword in the gut

I’ll have to think about this one. But I’d rather watch it instead!!!

Ok, let me quote the Codex here (Not textually… Ugh).

On the defend of a certain relic on a certain tomb, Calgar finds himself head to head, fist to… Biggass-sword-that-works-better-than-a-lightsaber-and-certainly-faster-than-vader, with the avatar of war incarnate. While the Avatar of Khaine is able to pierce the armor, it’s due to the thing’s Strength, not the sword. On the rush to confront the avatar, Calgar LITERALLY smashes aspect warriors and guardians alike with the mere bulk of his armor.

HE KILLS STUFF BY MOVING.

Also, remember Vader is not exactly the incarnation of Speedy Gonzales. If calgar hits on Iniciative 1, Vader hits on iniciative 2.

Also, the Gauntlets of Ultramar literally stopped that burning, wailing, gigantic-sword-that-is-mightier-than-a-lightsaber dead on it’s tracks. The lightsaber qualifies as a a little less than a power weapon. The gauntlets of ultramar literally destroy stuff on a molecular level. Vader is outmatched!

The force must be ecualed to a psycher power. Calgar is virtually inmune to this…

Ok guys, there’s a lot of fluff flying around here but there is no way Vader can beat Calgar.

I think all you guys forgot about the central property of Ceramite. It conducts almost zero heat/energy, so, it is the GW equivalent of phrik, beskar, cortosis, take your pick. Ceramite is equally resistant to a lightsaber as any of the listed SW materials. Add to that adamantium is impervious to even lance weapons (to a certain degree), a lightsaber would be as useful as a toothpick. To put it into perspective the 15m thick adamantium prow of an Imperial Battleship can withstand a direct hit from a lance battery. Adamantium is a metal so strong it can withstand a precision lance strike, which is a focused beam of energy, similar to a laser, powerful enough to crack a planet’s crust at the point of impact.

As for the Force, Vader can’t use Force Lightning thanks to his mechanical hands so thats out of the picture. Even if Vader tries to choke Calgar to death, Calgar would simply breath through his skin. Yes, you read that right, he can breath through his skin. Uriel Ventris did so in Dead Sky Black Sun.

Now lets talk about weapons. As mentioned before, Calgar single handedly killed an Avatar of Khaine. The Avatar of Khaine wields the Wailing Doom, a sword of such power it can cleave through the mightiest of tanks in a single blow, no mortal armour can stand before it (even adamantium). Calgar was able to catch the downward stroke of the Wailing Doom with the Gauntlets of Ultramar, and smote the Avatar with his other fist, plunging it deep into its chest. The Gauntlets are indestructible, preiod. Lightsaber or no, the Gauntlets of Ultramar smote a God, can you do that with a lightsaber? All Calgar needs to do is to touch Vader and thats it, game over. Add to that two bolters mounted on each fist firing .75cal armour piercing high explosive slugs, a bolt round can blow a man in half. Have you seen what a .50cal can do in real life? Double that and you’ll get an idea of what a bolt round can do. And he’s got two bolters.

Now lets talk about combat prowess. Vader is a Sith Lord, who hunted down Jedi for fun (ok, maybe not for fun, but you know what I’m saying) and choked people to death from aboard another ship. Outstanding for SW fluff. Now, where in all the voluminous SW fluff did Vader bring down a Star Destroyer with the force? I believe that was part of the game play for The Force Unleashed, which is inaccurate anyway seeing as a Star Destroyer cannot operate in the atmosphere of a planet. Vader, using the Force, is faster than a human being, and, can predict the future somewhat to deflect blaster shots.

Calgar is a Space Marine, the Emperor’s Finest. There are more worlds in the Imperium than there are Space Marines, and yet, that is enough. Their combat prowess is such that any one Space Marine is worth at least any 10 other combatants. Their physiology, as highlighted in an above post, is such that they can survive wounds that will kill a man thrice over. They move with such speed the average human eye cannot even register their movements, and with such power they can snap every bone in your body using just their thumb and little pinky. Calgar is amongst the greatest of the Imperium’s Space Marines, whose deeds fill 28 volumes in the Librarium of the Fortress of Hera, whose deeds are surpassed only by Robuote Guilliman, the Primarch of the Ultramarines alone.

So here is the fight. Calgar and Vader square off with one another, Vader activates his lightsaber and adopts a defensive stance. Calgar emulates. They circle one another waiting for an opening. They strike at each other, testing each other’s defences and skills. Abruptly Vader launches into a vicious assault, raining blows down onto Calgar, who deflect them with ease. Vader senses an opening and strikes, his lightsaber crackling as it impacts Calgar’s thigh. The Ceramite holds as it dissipates the energy of the light saber. Surprised his foe did not topple over instantly, Vader drops his guard for an instant. Faster than any eye can see, Calgar slams his fist into Vader’s chest. Vader’s chest vaporises in an explosion of sparks and gore, and Calgar rips off Vader’s helm as a trophy to be taken back to the Fortress of Hera.

V 2.0

Same scenario, this time, Calgar acts first, spraying Vader with bolt rounds. With a supreme force of will, Vader deflects each incoming round and holds his ground. Calgar runs out of ammunition and adopts a defensive stance. Vader takes a leaf out of Calgar’s book and hurls his lightsaber at Calgar. Marneus, a veteran of thousands of campaigns, and slayer of a thousand fell champions, easily dodges the throw. As the lightsaber careens back towards him, Calgar wraps his hand around the “blade” and crushes the hilt with his free hand. Vader, now without a weapon, resorts to using the Force, and crushes Calgar’s wind pipe. Momentarily fazed, Calgar switches over to his secondary respiratory systems and charges forward. Vader, realising the ineffectiveness of his attack, starts to crush Calgar’s heart. As Calgar starts to feel light headed his secondary heart kicks in and again, he charges forward. Vader, now desperate, attempts to arrest Calgar’s motion by snapping his femurs. Grunting in pain, Calgar relies on his armour to keep him moving and closes the final few meters to Vader in the blink of an eye. Bearing down on the Sith Lord, Calgar raises his Gauntlets of Ultramar Calgar hammers his fists down onto Vader, reducing his entire upper body to a pulp of gore and electrical wiring.

Bottom line? Calgar will win, ‘nuf said.

Oh, and those injuries sustained from Vader’s Force powers? They’re already healing, his trachea is almost operational again, his primary heart is beating fine, even his femurs are beginning to calcify.

Calgar wins, there is no doubt about it.

Hahaha! That was fun to read. Well done, Sup3rF1uid.

In episope 1, when qu-gon (sorry on buctering his name) is fighting the sith in the power plant, those red energy fields kept springing up, and both acted annoyed when they did, but didnt do any force attacks, unlike when they where open. And lightsabers could cut through adamantium, although, it would take a very long time, it takes a while to cut through blast doors. Blast doors are thicker, but adamantium has far better protection. And if calgar wants to, he could catch the blade part in his hand. But on the energy field thing, iron halo shoud work.

All i can say is, i hope vader is really fast, cause he’s gonna have some running to do if they ever face one another

If you read the Space Marines codex, then you know that Calgar has beaten a god incarnate (the Avatar of Khaine). Calgar beat him by punching him. The Avatar is FIRE. Calgar’s Gauntlets can almost definitely deflect the lightsaber AT LEAST twice. Which would give Calgar ample time to punch Vader in the face. Or shoot him. Or chuck him off a cliff. If you forget, look in the Space Marines codex to see a list of ALL a space marines power.