Suggested by Julian Stone
For this match, Sauron has The One Ring To Rule Them All. Facing Alucard in a brutal fight to the end. Only one can survive despite how long the match might last.
Who wins?
Alucard (Hellsing) Vs Sauron
November 20th, 2009 at 1:18 pm -
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November 20, 2009
#1
Of course I’m gonna say reality manipulation.
November 20, 2009
#2
arent they both immortal?
November 20, 2009
#3
I’d say in a one on one battle, Alucard has this. It’s already been established that the strength of Tolkein’s characters lie in their manipulative skills, not in duels.
@ss, yes Sauron is immortal, but seeing as it often takes him many years to come back with sufficient power, putting him down once is enough to be considered a victory in a duel.
November 20, 2009
#4
Wait, I might not much about Sauron, but LOTR characters have repeatedly surprised me when their true ‘powers’ are explained.
So couldn’t Sauron be able to make it an even fight?
Someone please enlighten me.
November 20, 2009
#5
Yeah, if Isildur could do…Al sure can
November 20, 2009
#6
Neither opponent has what it takes to end the other. I don’t see this battle every truly ending. However I do see it working out where Alucard ends up repeatedly defeating Sauron for all eternity.
November 20, 2009
#7
Wouldnt Alucard eventually end up like gollum?? you know, after milennia of torment and torture from the one ring…
now that would be epic…
and doesnt alucard require blood?
November 20, 2009
#8
On one hand, Alucard can repeatedly regenerate/return from any amount of damage that Sauron could inflict unless Alucard believes that he himself does not exist, and Sauron’s spirit could not be destroyed by anything Alucard does unless he brings the One Ring to Mt. Doom.
I’m going to give it to Sauron by a small margin, because manipulative tactics and breaking minds are exactly his forte. I wouldn’t put it past him to deduce a method of twisting Alucard’s mind or fooling him somehow into willing himself out of reality with his own self-disbelief.
November 20, 2009
#9
@ AHEM: How would Sauron know of Alucards one weakness?
Also, if Alucard has Schrodingers powers for this battle, can Sauron do anything to Alucard?
November 20, 2009
#10
Alucard has a weakness? Forgive me but i must have misread.
@Sapper
No. Alucard no longer needs blood. In fact even before gaining quantum reality powers he could hibernate for 20 years without blood and when he got some he killed about 4 or 5 men in under a minute. With the reality warping power he destroyed 3 million souls he had and came back 30 years later just fine. He was only hungry.
@AHEM
Try convincing a regular Human he/she doesn’t exist. Would that work? No. Now try convincing Alucard who is the most powerful vampire to ever exist to believe he doesn’t exist. Even with Sauron trying to manipulate Alucard, it won’t work.
November 20, 2009
#11
that still doesnt cover the tortureous and mind flaying properties of the 1 ring.
November 20, 2009
#12
Weakness in the loosest sense of the word, as in it’s near impossible to use against him.
November 20, 2009
#13
The simple fact that he can question his own state of existence might imply that Al is in doubt as to its validity… Sauron could be the catalyst that convinces him he doesn’t exist…
I mean hey, what is existence really, right? All the power in the UNIVERSE and you might still not know the meaning of existence…
November 20, 2009
#14
@Asger
Dosent Schrodingers power cover up alucards weakness or something, and isnt that how he came back?
November 20, 2009
#15
@ envoy
Schrodingers poweris what gave him that weakness
November 20, 2009
#16
@ Envoy:
Upon consuming Schrodinger, Schrodinger was unable to tell who he was among the other familiars, so in esscence neither did Alucard.
November 20, 2009
#17
Well, Sauron has a history of breaking down the spirits of many a persistent character…..but in terms of combat, I would see it hard for him to keep up with Alucard. In terms of power, with the one ring….mmhh can’t say any feats, besides swinging Grom around quite powerfully….to bad Tolkien never really fleshed out the abilities of the Maiar……tis unfortunate.
- the pondering fool
November 20, 2009
#18
@Sam
Thats one of the arguments used in the Alucard Vs Seppy thread. It won’t work! If that were true then none of us would be here.
@Sapper
“that still doesnt cover the tortureous and mind flaying properties of the 1 ring.”
……Alucards all ready Batshit insane. Being tortured is nothing new to him either. He also displays telepathy and telekenisis.
Besides the Maiar have not be shown as having a large amount of reality warping powers. I know they have some, but to defeat Alucard you would have to wipe everything out of existence including yourself and then rebuild it.
He is “everywhere and nowwhere at once.”
November 20, 2009
#19
Why is Alucard so popular? I dont even know about him, and Sauron is VERY powerful, but i’m guessing so is Alucard. So i can’t choose yet.
November 20, 2009
#20
The picture of Alucard in this match remind me alot of Vincent Valentine from Final Fantasy…..total random comment, but it was on my mind…..
- the pondering fool
November 20, 2009
#21
@wtf bomber
You know. Researching a subject before debating is a good idea. Knowing something is always half the battle. All you have to do is go to google and type in Alucard. The one that has hellsing with it, will be him. Oh, and the reason why i like him? Others may share this view point but i just think he is badass.
November 20, 2009
#22
“Why is Alucard so popular?”
- The same reason that the Hulk, Kharn, the Juggernaut are popular. One look at them and you know that the shit is about to hit the fan for somebody.
November 20, 2009
#23
@ Kenny….
True, true. Don’t forget people like Ghost Rider too. When he goes Ghost, *slices throat*
Now to the fight. Well, Tolkien is horrible at battles. But, I believe the Maiar helped create the world….
November 20, 2009
#24
well on one hand we got an evil sorcerer with anear unlimited source of power in an object and on the other a modernized version of the no life king who not only is packing heat, but as near unstoppable as Sauron is wearing the ring.
Alright quick question has Sauron given up any form of humanity or human for that matter? I only ask because I know only so little of him.
November 20, 2009
#25
@KG15
Sauron never had any humanity. He was never human to start with. He was a maiar. The maiar are pretty much demigods in the LOTR series with immense powers that helped shape middle earth.
Alucard however has quantum reality powers which give him near infinite power.
November 20, 2009
#26
“@ AHEM: How would Sauron know of Alucards one weakness?”
I didn’t say he’d know for sure, just that it seemed Sauron would be capable of exploiting it if he did know. While I would assume Sauron wouldn’t know of his enemy’s weakness to start, sooner or later he’d have to figure it out. On the other side of the coin, Alucard wouldn’t know of Sauron’s one weakness(The One Ring being cast into one specific mountain in Arda), and the battle would go on indefinitely until one or both of them figured it out.
“Try convincing a regular Human he/she doesn’t exist. Would that work? No. Now try convincing Alucard who is the most powerful vampire to ever exist to believe he doesn’t exist. Even with Sauron trying to manipulate Alucard, it won’t work.”
Well I would agree that Sauron shouting mid-battle, “This doesn’t exist! You don’t exist! This is all fake!” would probably come to naught, Sauron still possesses the power necessary to twist and corrupt minds, and Alucard’s mostly insane psyche would be just the kind of environment he’d be comfortable working in. I wouldn’t dismiss so easily the possibility of Sauron twisting Alucard’s mind into a state where he realizes that he doesn’t exist and everything is an illusion or something like that, especially given that Sauron is a master strategist and plotter who could teach Batman how to scheme.
November 20, 2009
#27
well there goes my theory. ok so the question now remains will Sauron be able to convince Alucard he’ doesn’t exist provided he can get through the minds of all the souls he collected that is, if Sauron were to enter his mind?
November 20, 2009
#28
thsi would probably be the type of fight alucard would love
November 20, 2009
#29
I can see no clear winner at this time. But my vote is:
Sauron for the easy win.
November 20, 2009
#30
This is Alucard’s victory. His one weakness is so covered up that it is almost impossible to exploit considering his mental abilities shown even before the quantum reality. This such as telepathy, telekenesis, and hypnotizing others show his mental aptitude.
Also Alucard’s physical abilities seem to the point of unmeasurable.
They are both extremely powerful, but i dont see Sauron winning this.
November 21, 2009
#31
“I can see no clear winner at this time. But my vote is:
Sauron for the easy win.”
That makes no sense. You can’t see a winner, but you’re declaring someone the winner?
And how would Sauron get an ‘easy’ win? Do you know anything about Alucard? At all?
Anyway, Alucard has a tendency to rip his opponents limb from limb, so Sauron will lose the ring at some point.
November 21, 2009
#32
From what i’v gathered about Al’s fights, doesn’t he play/toy with his opponent, i.e. Gives them a chance to convince him he isnt…
I mean,come on! It’s Sauron we’re talking about here. He convinced the Numenor to battle gods, for pete’s sake!
The mere precense of the one ring robbed even Gandalf of his willpower. Combined and focused by Sauron, its power might be able to convice Al
November 21, 2009
#33
“I didn’t say he’d know for sure, just that it seemed Sauron would be capable of exploiting it if he did know. While I would assume Sauron wouldn’t know of his enemy’s weakness to start, sooner or later he’d have to figure it out.”
The weakness of having to be convinced you don’t exist isn’t something your opponent just…figures out, especially when you’re fighting said person, whereas Alucard would remove the ring, sooner or later.
“On the other side of the coin, Alucard wouldn’t know of Sauron’s one weakness(The One Ring being cast into one specific mountain in Arda), and the battle would go on indefinitely until one or both of them figured it out.”
Remember, this is the Sauron of the second age. In this case, simply removing the ring from Sauron is enough to be considered a victory, as he would be ‘put down’ for a sufficient time. If we were to go by the fact that Sauron’s spirit is immortal, there’d be no point in arguing against him in the first place, as his spirit is only truly destroyed not by the destruction of the ring, but at Dagor Dagorath, the final battle.
November 21, 2009
#34
“Remember, this is the Sauron of the second age. In this case, simply removing the ring from Sauron is enough to be considered a victory, as he would be ‘put down’ for a sufficient time. If we were to go by the fact that Sauron’s spirit is immortal, there’d be no point in arguing against him in the first place, as his spirit is only truly destroyed not by the destruction of the ring, but at Dagor Dagorath, the final battle.”
He does have a point you know. If this was said, the Sauron before he made the ring, destroying his body would not be effective enough, as he would be able to come back from a physical destruction. In the Akallabêth (the rise and fall of Numenor), he convinced King Akallabêth to try to take immortality by force from the Valar. Thing is, Numenoreans were forbidden to sail and land on the Undying lands. Long story short, Ilúvatar (“God”) separates the Undying Lands from the earth, making it spherical, and sinking the island of Numenor in the process (with Sauron included). He comes back, though not able to assume his fair form anymore (he can’t really deceive anyone that he looks….well, good. Sorta has this black armor all around him.).
- the pondering fool
November 21, 2009
#35
@Pondering Fool
“He comes back, though not able to assume his fair form anymore (he can’t really deceive anyone that he looks….well, good. Sorta has this black armor all around him.).”
If Sauron cant do that, then how does he convince alucard that he dosent exist, or was that something he coulnd’nt do without the ring?
November 21, 2009
#36
“@Pondering Fool
“He comes back, though not able to assume his fair form anymore (he can’t really deceive anyone that he looks….well, good. Sorta has this black armor all around him.).”
If Sauron cant do that, then how does he convince alucard that he dosent exist, or was that something he coulnd’nt do without the ring?”
No, Sauron was able to survive a physical destruction without the ring, because his “essence” was still within himself. When he makes the ring, he pours alot of his power into the ring, thereby increasing his power somehow (I do not understand how that would happen, just accept Tolkien’s word). But when the ring was separated from his body through his force, his connection with the ring was broken, meaning he lost alot of his power. Was this what you were asking about? I am sorry if I did not answered your question well enough if that is not the case. Anyway, have a pleasant day.
- the pondering fool
November 21, 2009
#37
well as far as i see it sauron would smack and cut alucard but alucard could just keep healing and shoot sauron.sauron not knowing wat guns are would see alucard as someone of great power and then alucard would take the ring by force either removing saurons arm finger or hand with a few shoots then as sauron has lost a lot of power he would just be easyier to kill over and over.
November 21, 2009
#38
@Pondering Fool
Don’t know if you’ve heard this before, but there’s one decent explanation for the increase in Sauron’s power with the ring, and that is that it taps into the ‘Morgoth element’ that lingers in Arda, Morgoth having expanded so much of his power into Arda itself. I believe Tolkien referred to this action as ‘Morgoth’s ring’.
You can read about it here
http://oakroadsystems.com/genl/ringfaq.htm#Q1-Rapport
The appropriate bit is under E11.
November 21, 2009
#39
“@Pondering Fool
Don’t know if you’ve heard this before, but there’s one decent explanation for the increase in Sauron’s power with the ring, and that is that it taps into the ‘Morgoth element’ that lingers in Arda, Morgoth having expanded so much of his power into Arda itself. I believe Tolkien referred to this action as ‘Morgoth’s ring’.
You can read about it here
http://oakroadsystems.com/genl/ringfaq.htm#Q1-Rapport
The appropriate bit is under E11.”
That was actually, quite new to me. Never thought of it in that way. Might also explain why Morgoth was not as powerful as he was at the end of the 1st age. He had spread his “essence” into so much of Arda, he was able to be crippled by King Fingolfin after the battle of Dagor Bragollach:
[This is from wiki]
“He [Fingolfin] smote the gates of Angband and challenged Morgoth to single combat. Though Morgoth feared Fingolfin (of all the Valar, Morgoth was the only one to know fear), he had to accept the challenge — or face shame in the eyes of his servants. Seven times Fingolfin wounded Morgoth and seven times Morgoth cried in pain, and seven times the host of Morgoth wailed in anguish, but he could not be slain for he was one of the Valar.
Wherever Morgoth attacked, Fingolfin would evade, avoiding Morgoth’s weapon Grond as it would crack the ground. Eventually, however, Fingolfin grew weary and stumbled on a crater. Then Morgoth pinned Fingolfin with his foot, and killed him, but not before the king, with his last act of defiance, hewed at Morgoth’s foot. Morgoth, from thence forward, always walked with a limp.”
- the pondering fool
November 22, 2009
#40
wow I love this battle because both parties only have one, really well hidden weakness and the other is the perfect person to exploit said weakness of the other if they could figure them out, but I really don’t see either figuring it out, maybe Sauron could figure out Alucard’s weakness, but Alucard has the dumb luck possibility of accidentally lopping off the ring… as it stands though I’m pretty torn it’s too even…
November 22, 2009
#41
i think its more likely that alucard will dismember sauron first
November 22, 2009
#42
“i think its more likely that alucard will dismember sauron first”
very likely but you have to take into account, messing with peoples heads is what Sauron does… he’s like an evil shrink…
November 22, 2009
#43
yes that is true, im just saying that the odds say that alucard wins, not that he cant lose
November 22, 2009
#44
“Might also explain why Morgoth was not as powerful as he was at the end of the 1st age. He had spread his “essence” into so much of Arda, he was able to be crippled by King Fingolfin after the battle of Dagor Bragollach”
Yeah I’d always seen him as spreading his essence too thinly across Arda, then Sauron went and did the opposite, pouring the majority of his power into a single object.
As for this battle, I think it goes to Alucard, as he could exploit Sauron’s weakness with far more ease. Perhaps Sauron could break his will if he were to capture Alucard, but he’s not going to do it in the heat of battle.
November 22, 2009
#45
Sauron wins this with ease
November 22, 2009
#46
Feel like elaborating Omega? Last time I checked randomly shouting things out doesn’t win a debate.
November 22, 2009
#47
“Feel like elaborating Omega? Last time I checked randomly shouting things out doesn’t win a debate.”
It doesn’t!? I am getting my refund……
- the pondering fool
November 22, 2009
#48
“Feel like elaborating Omega? Last time I checked randomly shouting things out doesn’t win a debate.”
well you didn’t shout loud or often enougH!!!
December 1, 2009
#49
Every time Sauron tries to convince Alucard that he doesn’t exist he gets a jackal round in the skull. It says in the description that Sauron has the one ring, and that means that as Alucard rips Sauron into tiny pieces, the ring will eventually be separated from the ring. Without the ring Sauron has no method of attacking Alucard.
Gotta give the the match to the king of vampires.
December 1, 2009
#50
If removing the ring does defeat Sauron then…. well, dismembering people into shreds is what Alucard does best. He’ll probably defeat him, though by accident. I’d say that decides it.
December 3, 2009
#51
Well Alucard is VERY smart and talented. This would be a really easy battle for Alucard heres how it will go down:
alucard meets Sauron they exchange some witty banter, they fight, Alucard probes into Saurons mind he finds out about the ring. after he finds out about the ring he sjoots of his hand and takes the ring, while saron is a big eye-ball alucard uses his quantum physics to appear at mount doom and drop the ring in the magma. As Sauron dies … Alucard insults him and walks off.
The only slightest of chances that Sauron has is umm … to promise to be his bitch … and thats not even winning (thats a tad contradictory XD)
December 3, 2009
#52
Enough!
This is down right silly… “the one ring taps into morgoth?” no, not quite… but, the one ring binds the other rings bearers to his will. Its assumed that Sauron gains their power from this… but i dont know. The One ring was forged to be extremely powerful in the first place… then to bind the other rings to the one ring he had to add some of his power…
okay think of saurons power as 10
the rings power is 10
Sauron gives the one ring some his power to bind the 16 rings he forged for the dwarves and man… now he is at 8
the ring with sauron’s power becomes a 12
then he puts on the ring 8+12 = 20
now not only is sauron a demi god, but he has positive control over the other ring bearers… its also assumed that he gains the other ring’s major power… but thats assumption
December 3, 2009
#53
Sorry for the double… heres my take…:
alucard is going to WTF pwn Sauron in the first meeting…
alucard is going to take the amazing ring from the cut down sauron, he will feel its presence and sense its power…
he will hold on to the ring… so sauron (not dead just without a physical body) grabs hold of Alucard and eventually speaks to his mind long enough to warp his mind into believing he doesnt exist…. he made a riverfolk (gollum) and a little bitch (frodo) who are naturally resistant to the rings power… go crazy, because he could… its not a stretch that he could convince Alucard that he doesnt exist…. but without Alucard knowing how to destroy the ring, (after having the ring for a day he would never want too, it would be his “precious”)
Sauron would win…
any questions?
December 4, 2009
#54
Well, what hapens when sauron gets eaten by the hell hound, his blood drank by alucard, or straight up killed by him?
December 4, 2009
#55
Um. Sapper Alucard already has all the power he needs. Why would he use the ring? Also your whole idea of it convincing him he doesn’t exist? Yeah…that’s not going to work. Alucard is already crazy. He has had over 3 million minds coexisting with him for around 40 or so years. He destroyed them all in 30 years and returned.
He will not be convinced by a ring that while possessing a large amount of power isn’t anywhere as strong as he is.
December 4, 2009
#56
With Schrodingers power, if Alucard thinks the ring has no power over him, then it has no power over him.
December 4, 2009
#57
“okay think of saurons power as 10
the rings power is 10
Sauron gives the one ring some his power to bind the 16 rings he forged for the dwarves and man… now he is at 8
the ring with sauron’s power becomes a 12
then he puts on the ring 8+12 = 20
now not only is sauron a demi god, but he has positive control over the other ring bearers… its also assumed that he gains the other ring’s major power… but thats assumption”
That’s flawed. Where did the ring’s original 10 come from? Its power can only ever come from Sauron’s own, which means that together the two can never pass 10 without help from an outside power. I find it hard to believe that this excess power comes from the wills of other ringbearers, as I doubt this would be enough to elevate Sauron to the power of a Valar (as stated). Making Morgoth’s essence a more sensible guess.
And according to your numbers, Sauron without the ring would still have a power of ‘8′, failing to explain why he became virtually powerless upon losing it.
To use numbers, I’d put it like this:
Sauron’s native power: 10
Sauron then creates the one ring with his own essence, pouring the majority of his power into it.
One ring’s power: 8
Sauron’s power without ring: 2
The one ring therefore must draw power from an outside source, as when used by Sauron, his overall power is increased.
Power drawn by one ring when on Sauron: 5
Sauron with one ring on: 15
The numbers aren’t perfect but the concept’s there. Anyway, we’re still aware that the ring’s main power lies in that of corruption.
December 5, 2009
#58
@Sapper007 before you ask alucard is powerful and REALLY crazy. alucard wasnt even tempted by a guy saying ‘we could enslave this stupid race’! so hes hardly gonna go ‘Oooohhhh look a gold ring I’m gonna put it on even though my mind reading powers tell me that Saron fears I will become more powerful, oh! And whats this? It gets destroyed if its dropped in fire? OK then I guess its gotta go.’ If anything Alucard woul get bored and destroy the ring or he would put the ring in the area near Saron to taunt him … FOREVER, he would even say an insult along the lines of ‘You could not find power of your own, so you had to take it from somewhere else? what a pathetic puiece of shit!’
I dont see Sauron winning this one I mean alucard can defeat MILLIONS of enemies by himself even if they have a BRILLIANT plan. But Sauron even with his HUGE army got beaten by a small group of: humans, a handful of hobbits, a handful of elves, a handful of dwarfs and a wizard. Plus Alucard cant be killed, Sauron, all he needs are his fingers cut off and then put in some bloody magma!
December 5, 2009
#59
“he will hold on to the ring… so sauron (not dead just without a physical body) grabs hold of Alucard and eventually speaks to his mind long enough to warp his mind into believing he doesnt exist…. he made a riverfolk (gollum) and a little bitch (frodo) who are naturally resistant to the rings power… go crazy, because he could… its not a stretch that he could convince Alucard that he doesnt exist…. but without Alucard knowing how to destroy the ring, (after having the ring for a day he would never want too, it would be his “precious”)”
I was just thinking about a scenario like this right before I saw this post.
It should be noted that after a long time of using the One Ring, the ringbearer eventually becomes permanently invisible. This could go a step in making Alucard think he doesn’t exist, as no one sees or recognizes him, and all the while, Sauron is working on slowly corrupting him.
Alucard is pretty much insane, yeah, but I think that would only make it easier for Sauron to manipulate him. If his mind is already chaotic and not clinging to the stability of sanity, twisting that already crazy mess into new shapes would be a bit easier, just as its easier to stir mud than to break rocks.
December 6, 2009
#60
Why would Alucard want to add a smidget of power to his potentialy infinite power? He would take one look at the ring and throw it away, considering it nought more then a ‘worthless trinket’. Hell, he could just read Saurons mind, find out about Mt.Doom and teleport Sauron into Mt.Doom for the lulz.
December 7, 2009
#61
First of all, read the lord of the rings before you comment. second while i am a helsing fan, sauron is a god-like diety. he isn’t a god but the only reahe might have well be. and third, the movies depict sauron as an eye, but thats only one interpretation, as the “eye” when refered to in the book is metaphorical for “souron is watching you and giving you a feeling of hopelessness.
December 7, 2009
#62
“he wasnt A god but he might as well have been” is what i meant
December 7, 2009
#63
“And according to your numbers, Sauron without the ring would still have a power of ‘8′, failing to explain why he became virtually powerless upon losing it.”
this was an example… showing how the ring bolsters saurons previous powers but if you want to read it that way fine… Morgoth’s power was not contained in the One Ring… thats dumb….
“And according to your numbers, Sauron without the ring would still have a power of ‘8′, failing to explain why he became virtually powerless upon losing it.”
except that he still controlled a good portion of the world for an age…. virtually powerless…
“Sauron then creates the one ring with his own essence, pouring the majority of his power into it.”
the books say a portion, a portion isnt a majority….
@mechgeek,
your post is so full of fail, i dare not taint this thread further…
I think AHEM summed it up nicely for me… but to reiderate…
the One Ring has tempted demigods… why would Alucard be any different? oh he wouldnt… and while it whispers to him nasty little things over and over again… all the while he becomes more and more attached to the one thing that is killing him…
Can saurons mind be read by alucard? doubtful… even pecking at saurons mind through the Palantíri of old proved useless only seeing what he was thinking at the second you connected to him….
December 7, 2009
#64
Can the ring offer Al ANYTHING he isn’t already capable of? If it can’t top quantum-reality manipulation then it won’t be of any intrest to Alucard.
December 7, 2009
#65
you keep saying it as if he wouldnt want it… it tells him he wants it… he cant resist it… its magically calling to him… its his precious
December 7, 2009
#66
Even though you’ve given no reason as to WHY he would want it. Al’s a loon, but by no means is he an idiot.
December 7, 2009
#67
@Sapper007
“Morgoth’s power was not contained in the One Ring… thats dumb….”
Once again, the theory is that the ring tapped into it, as it was the only other evil essence still within the world, not that it contained it. Where do you propose the power comes from?
“except that he still controlled a good portion of the world for an age…. virtually powerless…”
I was referring to when the ring (and hence most of Sauron’s power, as shown below) was destroyed and he became nothing but a shadow blown away by the wind.
“the books say a portion, a portion isnt a majority….”
“Since the other Rings were themselves powerful, Sauron was obliged to place much of his native power into the One to achieve his purpose.
Creating the Ring simultaneously strengthened and weakened Sauron’s power. On the one hand, as long as Sauron had the Ring, he could control the power of all the other Rings, and thus he was significantly more powerful after its creation than before; and putting such a great portion of his own power into the Ring ensured Sauron’s continued existence so long as the Ring existed. On the other hand, by binding his power within the Ring, Sauron became dependent on it — without it his power was significantly diminished.”
Great. Great portion.
December 10, 2009
#68
“Even though you’ve given no reason as to WHY he would want it. Al’s a loon, but by no means is he an idiot.”
And neither was Gandalf(a demi god), Saruman,(demi-god), Isuldur, (king), Aragorn, (king), And hundreds of elves, dwarves, humans and hobbits… some with no need of power or trinkets…. yet the ring called to them… the only reason, Gandalf and Galadriel refused the ring is they knew its purpose…
and besides doesnt Alucard have some unresolved feelings about a little girl or something??? Gateway…
what all these had in common is they saw the ring… and Alucard would see the ring…
December 10, 2009
#69
I’m just joining this but can anyone prove to me that Alucard can in fact be corrupted despite the fact that since he’s a vampire he has no soul? Also Sapper your kind of breaking the no limit falacy rule. Saying that because subject a was affected by it therefore subject b will be affected by it with out definite proof other then characters not even in the same class be affected by it is not fair. Add onto that the fact that the character in question has no soul to corrupt then your arguement doesn’t hold much weight unless you can prove that the ring can in fact corrupt undead, souless vampires.
December 10, 2009
#70
its assumed… and stop with the no limit bullshit… look… everytime some one says Im breaking the no limit fallacy it’s usually followed by them breaking their version of the no limit fallacy…
“can any one prove to me that Alucard can in fact be corrupted despite the fact that since he’s a vampire he has no soul?”
Can any one prove to me that the Souless are not corrupted despite having no soul?
I can play this all day…
look wights are souless… yet they are drawn to the one ring… the undead were drawn to it… having no exact vampire with Quantum this or that comparision thats the best example… and since there is still sentient thought rattling around in that skull of alucards… it leads me to believe that he could be convinced that the ring could help him do what ever he does…
December 10, 2009
#71
What can the ring offer Al? Power? Yeah, cause he REALLY needs more of that. World domination? Yes Alucard with his reality manipulation would really need help in that department.
On the subject of reality manipulation, Alucard can think the ring has no control over him and *Ding!* Ring has no control.
December 10, 2009
#72
Well assumptions are the mother of all fuck ups(Under Siege 2). The only way I see Alucard comng into possesion of the ring is after he eats Sauron. But the match is over after that because if not its pointless to even have it continue after the opponents physical body is destroyed. That’s like saying that after MC’s been kiilled the match still isn’t done because Cortana isn’t dead yet. You know why it makes no sense? Because its a piece of equipment. And I’m not saying that Alucard can or can not be affcted by the ring I’m saying that after Alucard seperates Sauron fro the physical realm it should be over.
December 10, 2009
#73
Also if you want us to stop with the rules then keep the battles on the physical plane. After the body is destroyed its over. No ring bullshit or floating souls. That’s gay.
December 10, 2009
#74
except as it happens to be… the one ring is an extension of Sauron… its not merely equipment…
and i would agree… except that his physical body had been killed before…
and as admin stated:
“For this match, Sauron has The One Ring To Rule Them All. Facing Alucard in a brutal fight to the end. Only one can survive despite how long the match might last.”
so, Sauron would come back…. thousand years 100 thousand years… does it matter??? the longer the better for Sauron…
and besides… Sauron at one time could warp and change shape at will as well… and i believe he even took the shape of *gasp* a vampire… so maybe Sauron isnt the push over you all are making him out to be…
December 10, 2009
#75
Sapper it matters not. Every time Sauron comes he’ll get the same ass kicking as before.
December 10, 2009
#76
hey midnite dont show up late to a party and bitch about the beer being gone…
and yeah he might get beat… especially with the One Ring… but its terminal from there its going to take 10x^however long it takes years but its still going to eventually convince him he doesnt exist… and since he cant drink Saurons blood and get his memories…(lack of body lack of blood, just one of those strange things) he will never know how to destroy the ring….
and besides i did some research… and i cant find anything that states he needs to be convinced he doesnt exist… to not exist… nor does anything mention about his will becoming reality… but it does say something about him dying… something like he knows how he is going to die…
December 10, 2009
#77
@sapper-Alucard can read minds though so your point is moot. Also where did you research because yes Alucard has the ability of quantum munipulation. Also he can only be killed by a human pure of heart so nothing Sauron has can kill him if you want to get all no limity on us.
December 10, 2009
#78
Also I don’t like bear. Grey Goose Vodka for me.
December 10, 2009
#79
I think i covered the mind reading thing…
I looked a few wiki’s….
and I was going off what every one in every Alucard fight has been saying and preaching thus far…. so when i couldnt find it I called bullshit…
/shrug…
If its proven… i conceed…. but until then… i want some proof….
December 10, 2009
#80
This one is an easy win for Alucard, and no amount of dreaming from Sauron or his fans is going to change it. Alucard will not be defeated in combat, and even if he were, he would still just reappear one sec after having his body crushed, releasing a new seal. Never dying or even getting weakened, while Sauron will easily go down.
And with quantum reality manipulation he can do anything. He can become Saurons head and chop himself off the body, he can become a nuke in Saurons chest, heck, he can even become a super tight pair of panties around saurons lower legs, making the Dark Lord topple over at once.
And Sauron won’t manage to bring down Alucards mind either. He is too smart, psychopathic and sociopath to be affected quickly enough. And sooner or later(perhaps a million years after the first fight, perhaps 2 seconds) Alucard will just hurl the Ring somewhere Sauron can’t get it.
This one belongs to the Vampire.
December 10, 2009
#81
wow… just like that???
Sometimes i wonder why i reference pages and spend time looking shit up….
maybe i should whack off to some Asian cartoon pron and hate myself… might make things easier… maybe then i will get some of these nut job anime/magna crazy mess of epilepsy causing junk you call art…
December 10, 2009
#82
Yeah, just like that.
I didn’t read the whole discussion, did you spend a lot of time looking up facts for Saurons sake? If you did, I pity you. It blows to go through a lot of work to find arguments when the other guy is so powerful he’ll win with a fart.
And i guess the last part means you are very irritated/pissed and don’t like manga?
December 10, 2009
#83
Alucard gained his reality maniplulation after consuming Schrodinger. According to Wikipedia:
“The exact nature of Schrödinger’s abilities has yet to be defined, although, due to the “Schrödinger’s cat” references, they could be quantum-reality based. This is indirectly confirmed by the Major – he states that Schrödinger only exists for as long as he is aware of himself. He was able to appear in Hellsing’s conference room without difficulty, and also appeared to Zorin Blitz while Blitz was attempting to attack Seras Victoria’s mind, indicating that he can appear in mental realms as well. Schrödinger himself mysteriously states that he is “everywhere and nowhere”, possibly meaning that, if he believes that he exists somewhere, then he will.
This also explains his apparent regeneration/immortality. If he believes that he is unscathed, then he is.”
December 10, 2009
#84
Am I the only one who loled at the exchange between sapper and whacko? “Wow, just like that?” “Yeah, just like that.” Funny stuff. But sapper you just got to look fro the good stuff like street fighter, akira, fatal fury, princess mononoke and many more. Its the stuff they putting out now and garbage as channels like adult swim thats for queers.
December 11, 2009
#85
ooooooh…. so you want me to go for game mechanics for this… well… if chun li can whoop him….
December 11, 2009
#86
” If you did, I pity you. It blows to go through a lot of work to find arguments when the other guy is so powerful he’ll win with a fart.”
especially when you go against pimply faced douche bags who think they know something about literature and intellect… and have no debate skills beyond, “oh yeah… well my dad knows karate!”
December 11, 2009
#87
Well, personally i’m not that into literature, but my intellect ain’t that bad. And i know that sauron doesn’t pack any means that can beat down quantum reality maniulation. I mean, when the other guy can survive being cut to atoms and turn himself into a nuke, you are pretty hard pressed to do anything about it. Especially if pure destructiveness ain’t your strongest point.
December 11, 2009
#88
Reality Manipulation?
Why must people always underestimate Suaron. The man is more successful at taking over Middle Earth than even Morgoth, and he an out and out God. Alucard is powerful, but there’s nothing he can do to Sauron and Saurons speciality is breaking peoples minds.
Sauron is fully capable of doing that without using the ring. Point in case, “The Necromancer” persona and his corruption of men into ghoul-like creatures. He breaks minds and bodies to him will when he puts his mind to it. If he wants to persuade Alucard that he doesn’t exist, he’ll make it so.
December 11, 2009
#89
finally someone with a brain shows up…
December 11, 2009
#90
@Jwlyas:
I’m sorry, but you are wrong. You could quite literally put him under a barrage of nukes for a million years and he wouldn’t get hurt at all. He’s exsistence is, as said earlier, based only on WHAT and WHERE he wants to be, outside factors doesn’t have any say in that matter. So, to beat him you either have to make him believe that he doesn’t exist, or possibly blow up the universe.
Also, we all know about Saurons powers, position and feats. We know that he specialise in breaking the mind of the enemy, but you just won’t get Alucards mind out of circulation before he has ripped you to pieces. And no matter how godly sauron is, he is easy to rip apart when you can tear through anything and sport guns that shoots exploding ammunition to make holes in people that are larger than the entire section from the hip to the neck. He has taken out several guys easily outmatching Sauron in raw power, and can use the “Control Art Restriction System” to lift the restrictions placed on him, effectively becoming absolutely SICK in all forms of combat.
I know very well what Sauron can do, but Alucard is far too much.
December 11, 2009
#91
So, I nominate Alucard for the FP award.
December 11, 2009
#92
“finally someone with a brain shows up…”
So anybody with a different opinion to you is an idiot? Nice view of things you have there.
December 11, 2009
#93
“”finally someone with a brain shows up…”
So anybody with a different opinion to you is an idiot? Nice view of things you have there.”
Not necessarily… only the people that say a being that has been controlled in
the past wont be controlled by an artifact that has… can and will bind every
mind but a God’s to it… Alucard is extreme… I never said he wasnt… but
if a human can bind him to his service like Van Hellsing did… then Sauron
could do it through the One Ring… which is part of Sauron BTW… and yes Alucard
would WTF pwn Saurons physical body… but without destroying the ring he
lives on…
so if you cant grasp that…
your an idiot…
don’t get mad if the shoe doesnt fit…
December 11, 2009
#94
How Van Hellsing brough Alucard into his service is unknown. All that is known is that he was capable of killing Alucard because he was a pure-hearted human. Sauron, however lacks that advantage.
December 11, 2009
#95
Whenit comes down to it, we know nothing of the occasion when Van Helsing brought Dracula into his service. For all we know, Dracula won and joined up just because he liked the idea. This is of course a VERY slim chance, but it has been hinted that Van Helsing was more than a man and that Alucard has only gotten even stronger since joining Hellsing. In other words, it’s become tougher over the years.
And Alucard is not stupid, you know. If he feels something trying to enter his mind, he’ll just get the fight over with as quickly as possible and rid Sauron of the Ring. Alucard has more than enough willpower to resist the ring a few secs, and he doesn’t need more than that.
Hell, we cannot even know if the Ring has any effect at all. Alucard is mad, and is far more powerful than both the Ring and it’s master is. It doesn’t have anything to offer him. Not to mention he lacks a soul and is dead, and the chances of the Ring getting any swift results are pummeling through the floor. My money is still on the Vamp of awesum.
December 12, 2009
#96
Still arguments in Saurons favor? My nomination is still on Alucard.
December 12, 2009
#97
I’m not convinced that Sauron would be torn asunder by Alucards weaponry. Nothing but the sword that cut the ring from his fingers had ever hurt him before, and indeed nothing since. Considering the sheer number of magically enhanced elven weapons that tried, and failed, to even scratch his armour, why would metal projectiles do any better?
This isn’t a case of well structured armour, this is magic, immune to all earthly and most otherworldly weapons, made in the same manner as the ring and immune, potentially to all but the fires of its creation, and at the very least immune to all but hugely powerful weapons.
Pistols are just not going to cut it, explosive bullets or not.
December 12, 2009
#98
So…this fight will just be Alucard kicking Sauron up and down Middle Earth for all eternity without being able to break Saurons armour?
Huh.
December 12, 2009
#99
“So…this fight will just be Alucard kicking Sauron up and down Middle Earth for all eternity without being able to break Saurons armour?
Huh.”
No, Sauron will break Alucards mind soon enough. The armour just means Alucard isn’t able to do much about it other than try to break Saurons concentration… And Fail.
December 12, 2009
#100
I mentioned the pistols as weapons, but what i didn’t mention was that they are the weakest thing in Alucards arsenal. As said, he could just become a nuke, a copy of Narsil, or(theoretically) a friggin’ hypernova. And since he can read minds, it wouldn’t really be hard to find out what he is going to need. Actually, he don’t even need to. He can just become a knife inside saurons body and slice up everything.
If all else fail, why not just become a BIG gun and shoot Sauron into the sun? Even if he should survive in a way, he ain’t going anywhere after. And that certainly counts as a loss in my book.
No matter how you put it, quantum reality manipulation in the master vampire’s possession is a tough thing to deal with, way outta the league of the likes of Sauron.
And i also wanna ask, HOW is Sauron going to break Alucards mind? I have no doubt he’ll make it with enough time, but he won’t really have any time at all once Alucard gets bored or feels something trying to mess up his mind. Unless Sauron does it instantly, he’ll fail big time.