Here we have two master assassins going up against the king of Gondor!
For this battle Altair and Ezio are teaming up and have been told Aragorn is a templar and must be stopped. Aragorn is aware of the fact someone will try and kill him but he has no idea who.
They will have to make their way through Minis Tirith in order to kill him.
Altair will be from Assassin’s Creed I, whilst Ezio will be the Revelations version. Both characters will have their standard loadouts, Ezio will have datura bombs, smoke screen bomb and a cherry bomb.
One condition of the match is that neither assassin’s can use ranged equipment to kill Aragorn they must use their blade, sword, dagger, etc.
Aragorn is in the throne room throughout the battle.
Will the two assassins prevail?
OK, why are we talking about their childhoods? So, Aragorn can invite some friends and allies over, Eomer, Gimli, Prince Elphir, etc. Arwen and Legolas stayed with Aragorn for his entire life, so they’d be with him, and probably other friends, allies, and counselors would as well, unless they all suddenly decided to be heartless and let Elessar die.
“OK, why are we talking about their childhoods?”
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to be fair (to myself at least) i have repeatedly state it is irrelevant; ive just been disagreeing with the particulars out of habit.
Wouldn’t anyone coming in from outside Minis Tirith count as outside help though?
“Wouldn’t anyone coming in from outside Minis Tirith count as outside help though?”
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It isn’t just these three combatants, though. In a fairly realistic set-up, the two assassins have been placed into Middle Earth and need to assassinate Aragorn. As far as I can tell, both sides are allowed any means necessary to take out the other.
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@The Knower
I hope Andrew didn’t put you off, but he does have a bit of a point. How “tough” a childhood is isn’t generally given much weight here on the Pile. It is all about feats and what they’ve actually done. While I agree that the two assassins beat Aragorn in a two-on-one fight, that isn’t exactly the point of the match. It’s all about (at the moment) if the assassins can manipulate events to get to Aragorn.
@Aelfinn
Yeah your right. Just saying a hard childhood makes a hard man.
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I do believe the two assassin’s could manipulate events, as they’ve both shown they can. Example, Ezio caused the riots that broke through the Arsenal gates in Revelations. Ezio built the Roman Assassins Guild from scratch with peasants of no fighting techniques. Altair took command of Mayasaf at twenty-five, etc.
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I think the real question is, could they manipulate events to get Aragorn alone?
Firstly, i think its increipdibly retarded for Aragorn to have to stay in his Throne Room, I think the Upper Level of Minas Tirith is better, so im asking Hitman right now if he can change that Aragorn has to stay.
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OK, obviously the Assassins will spy on Aragorn. What if they realize he’s actually a good King, than they all get pissed at whoever sent the Assassins to kill Aragorn.
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Anyway, can they take out Aragorn and all his allies, not to mention his guards and whatever spells and traps he may have had placed to as safeguards?
When ezzio rebuilt the assassins in brotherhood there were already people who supported him and what he was doing, same with the riots and same with altair
In this match they are being dropped into an alien land with no friends to speak of to kill a king who is absolutely beloved by ALL of his subjects
What is your basis for thinking aragorn would be dumb enough to wander off alone when he knows he is being hunted? He would at the very least have legolas and gimli with him and ive no doubt that that trio will be to much for the assassins to handle
If the assassin’s could take the trio unawares, (highly unlikely), they’d have an edge. Also, if Aragorn leaves the throne to walk about, the assassins would stand atop a building and toss down a datura bomb and thats the end of that story
They have to kill Aragorn up close, not with ranged weapons.
But they can kill Legolas and Gimli and any other of his allies with ranged weapons or bombs, then attack him head on.
@the knower
How the hell would they not be prepared when they KNOW they are being hunted? They would be. And even you admitted that chances are small, this debate isnt about finding a one in a million chance for one side to win, its about determining the most likely outcome, which in this case, based on what we know about the assassins and what we know about aragorn gimli and legolas, is that the assassins fail their mission
I never said not prepared. I said unaware. Even the most prepared man can be taken by surprise.
They’re using freaking bombs. How will they not kill him, just the people right next to him? Also, the “natives” (I’ll call them that for now) won’t be just like talking, then be randomly attacked and be like “Oh my Eru, we were attacked! Oh yeah, we’re being hunted…”
I didn’t say they had to use bombs to attack his allies, any ranged weapon will do, (ezios crossbow?). And did you even read the setup? “Aragorn knows hes being hunted”. So yeah, he won’t but like that. Idiot.
I actually cannot understand your post, since apparently you can’t understand mine.
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“And did you even read the setup? “Aragorn knows hes being hunted”. So yeah, he won’t but like that. Idiot.”
What does that even mean? Do you even know what side I’m on? Please come back with an intelligible answer next time.
How will they manipulate events? They would have to do something completely inhumane and horrid multiple times, then frame Aragorn for it somehow.
All the talk of the assassins formenting discontent among the populations seems incredibly unlikely to me: putting aside everything Aragorn did to save the people, which no one will be quick to forget, Aragorn is a master diplomat, and has journeyed far learning the hearts of people throughout all the land not only of Gondor, but even areas beyond what the typical map of middle-earth shows. He knows what the people are thinking and how to get them to keep faith in him. Rohan will also always be loyal since they also were saved through his help and he suffered with them through their battles. The only people the assassins might get riled up are maybe the dunlendings and the haradwaith, and neither are in any position to cause any harm to the kingdom.
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I also think, what with all the birds and elves likely to be in the city, there will be a ready spy network that can seriously hurt the assassins’ chances. Elves in particular, but even dwarves and men can learn the tongues of birds and use them as spies and messengers. Aragorn knows he’s being hunted, so why not set the birds on the alert, and see if the assassins can even realize it, let alone sneak past them anywhere.
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but I still think the palantir is not being given enough weight, and could make the birds an obsolete asset.
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Lets also keep in mind that Aragorn has significant mental abilities, and could possibly cow either or both of the assassins into submission or at least terrible fear as he did with the Mouth of Sauron. He even managed to overcome Sauron in a contest of wills–true, he had some circumstantial bonuses over Sauron, but the feat is still impressive.
Aragorn is superior to a normal human in may ways. He can easily beat the two assasins in HtH as they are normal humans.
He also has Anduril and he’s also a experienced fighter and tracker.
@CMEPTB34
I didn’t know he could use birds? Thats awesome.
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Aragorn and his allies would totally kill the assassins but if the assasssins managed to get Aragorn alone, (very, very doubtful), then they’d most likely kill him.
TrashMan, do you know the scenario? The Assassins have to get Aragorn alone, which they won’t do, before they have one percent chance of killing him, not fight him HtH, in which he’ll lose.
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@everyone: However, is there any LIKELY way for the Assassins to win?
@epicazeroth
The only way I can see the assassins winning is if they get him alone, (never gonna happen), if they find out hes a nice guy, or if they use smoke screens on him and his allies and in the smoke, eagle vision and then stabs him.
Other than that, I don’t think the assassins will ever win.
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And yeah, @trashman, Aragorn wouldn’t beat then two masters assassin in HtH.
What if they find out he’s a benevolent leader?
Well Im guessing they all go out for a budweiser.
>implying a high king of the dunedain would drink such a terrible beer.
he’d be drinking proper ale, not fizzy gnats urine
Hahah!
More like some royal wine from The Royal Pub!
@the knower
But the only brew for the brave and truuuuueeee, comes from the green dragon
“But only the brew for the brave and truuuuueeeee, comes from the green dragon”
Sounds like you’ve been having some of that breeeeewwwww
Seriously, can the Assassins actually find a somewhat likely way for them to beat Aragorn?
Nope none.
OK, if no one else has an answer, I’m pretty sure Aragorn won, unless someone proves otherwise.
No ever agrees that Aragorn wins, unless…..anyone, no? Okay.
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Just win, or FP Award, as everyone thought he had no chance originally?
Well no one thought he had a chance when we all DIDN’T know he could get help from allies but then when we found out he COULD, then things went downhill for the assassins. I’d vote on just a win, in my oponion.
OK.
Elessar seems to have won, but not FP Award worthy, right?
I’m not sure I would call it yet, as I feel the assassins were somewhat underrepresented, and i wouldn’t be surprised if they still had a trick or 2 up their sleeves, but I do feel that we’ve established that it is Aragorn’s match to lose.
Instead of saying the Assassins can win, please, enlighten me, and tell me how. Don’t just say “They’ll have tricks and be able to manipulate events.”
Yeah we need something speific, “tricks up they’re sleeves” is much too vague.
If they’ve been in this specific type of situation before (no allies AT ALL, no connections, no equipment other than what’s on them, trying to assassinate a completely beloved and supported leader), please tell us, and they’ll have a chance.
I just don’t know much about them, so I can’t answer. And I don’t think very many people at all have come up with enough info on their side. I think we’ve busted the idea of them causing a revolt, but I’d be surprised if that was their only real option. They’ve had precious little voice comingup with options for them
So… you don’t know about them, but you say they’re being not well argued?
I’m saying I know little, and little has been said to inform me. If that is all there is to say about them, ok.
“I’m saying I know little, and little has been said to inform me. If that is all there is to say about them ok”.
It’s not all theres is to say, but to be honest, none of anything else the two assassins did would possbily help the assassins in anyway.
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Also, you said they have a trick up they’re sleeve but you don’t know much about them? How does that work?
“i wouldn’t be surprised if they still had a trick or 2 up their sleeves”
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meaning that I suspect there is more, not knowing what it would be or if that is even the case. LOTR is my expertise, that’s all I’ve given info on. If I had anything definite on the assassins, I would have said it, not just hinted at it
If you don’t, don’t say it, and unless anyone who knows about the Assassins says something, Aragorn wins apparently.
“@the knower
But the only brew for the brave and truuuuueeee, comes from the green dragon!”
But:
“There is an inn, a merry old inn
beneath an old grey hill,
And there they brew a beer so brown
That the Man in the Moon himself came down
One night to drink his fill.
The ostler has a tipsy cat
that plays a five-stringed fiddle;
And up and down he runs his bow,
Now squeaking high, now purring low,
Now sawing in the middle.
The landlord keeps a little dog
that is mighty fond of jokes;
When there’s good cheer among the guests,
He cocks an ear at all the jests
And laughs until he chokes.
They also keep a hornéd cow
as proud as any queen;
But music turns her head like ale,
And makes her wave her tufted tail
and dance upon the green.
And O! the rows of silver dishes
and the store of silver spoons!
For Sunday there’s a special pair,
And these they polish up with care
on Saturday afternoons.
The Man in the Moon was drinking deep,
and the cat began to wail;
A dish and a spoon on the table danced,
The cow in the garden madly pranced,
and the little dog chased his tail.
The Man in the Moon took another mug,
and then rolled beneath his chair;
And there he dozed and dreamed of ale,
Till in the sky the stars were pale,
and dawn was in the air.
Then the ostler said to his tipsy cat:
‘The white horses of the Moon,
They neigh and champ their silver bits;
But their master’s been and drowned his wits,
and the Sun’ll be rising soon!’
So the cat on his fiddle played hey-diddle-diddle,
a jig that would wake the dead:
He squeaked and sawed and quickened the tune,
While the landlord shook the Man in the Moon:
‘It’s after three!’ he said.
They rolled the Man slowly up the hill
and bundled him into the Moon,
While his horses galloped up in rear,
And the cow came capering like a deer,
and a dish ran up with the spoon.
Now quicker the fiddle went deedle-dum-diddle;
the dog began to roar,
The cow and the horses stood on their heads;
The guests all bounded from their beds
and danced upon the floor.
With a ping and a pong the fiddle-strings broke!
the cow jumped over the Moon,
And the little dog laughed to see such fun,
And the Saturday dish went off at a run
with the silver Sunday spoon.
The round Moon rolled behind the hill
as the Sun raised up her head.
She hardly believed her fiery eyes;
For though it was day, to her surprise
they all went back to bed!”
So, that one must be better.
Noooooo!!!!! It didn’t put spaces! Damn you, Apple for making your products like this!
Noooooo!!!!! It didn’t put spaces! Damn you, Apple for making your products like this! Whatever, just know every 5 lines is one stanza.
Ok….hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Ahhahahaha
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Who wrote that?
J.R.R. Tolkien wrote that. You can find it in The Adventures of Tom Bombadil (now that I think about it, this title may be from The Adventures of Tom Sawyer.). Well, in canon, Bilbo made it.
Haha, but, what does that poem do with, well, anything?
The match is over, pretty much. I was responding to the discussion about what they’ll drink if they become friends.
Yeah probaly something out of The Prancing Pony
Zazax and fantasywind, can you help me here? They thinks MK stomps and needs an FP Award: www.factpile.com/4793-mortal-kombat-vs-lord-of-the-rings/comment-page-2/
Surely altair and ezio would just find some way into the throne room and air assassinate him, or ezio, the better swordsman,would distract the guards in a swordfight then altair, the stealthier one, would sneak past the fight and then stab aragorn in the back while he is engaging ezio. If aragorn turns around to attack altair then he would keep him busy until ezio finished the guards and stab him in the back of the neck, aragorn dies either way.
sorry about the double post, just read the bomb part, ezio drops a smoke bomb in the fight and, while aragorn is choking then one of them kills him. also do ezio and altair have to escape the city, makkes it a bit harder but i still go with the assassins.
@ the knower
“Yeah we need something speific, “tricks up they’re sleeves” is much too vague” I know triple post but i need this, tricks up their sleeves might just mean hidden blade, you know, hidden up their sleeves
Have you read this thread? You think we never thought of that? We did, and agreed why it wouldn’t work.
Yeah I suggested the smoke bomb thing!
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I actually still dont get why that wouldn’t work. ??
Because there would be maybe a dozen others in the room, some maybe Elves able to possibly see through the smoke.
only just saw that part, I was really tired when I wrote that and couldn’t be bothered to read all of it
@epicazeroth
Does it say which gunpowder he is using in his bombs, if he is using the strong one surely then he would be able to gas most of them and even if elves can see through smoke they cannot possibly be asphyxiation proof.
Yeah I agree with tigeronyx, elves may be able to see through smoke, but they would have to cover they’re mouths to breath, and when taken by suprise thats easier said than done, trust me!. And @tigernoyx no it doesn’t say what gunpowder. Lets just say British gunpowder???
@the knower, that the stong weak or medium one, not played the game after I completed it
ok guys heres how the assasssins do it, they learn the language and the culture sneek into the castle kill the guards until the castle defense systems are weakand when they get to the throne room, toss a smoke bomb and use there eagle sense to find arogorn and assassinate hime
this is by far the most interesting scenario i’ve seen. and i think i agree with wolfion1212 the assassins are crafty bastards
Hi, I created an account just to comment on this.
It has been said that neither of the Assassin’s have taken down a beloved ruler. However, in DNA sequence 13 (I think so, I know the sequence is called Bonfire of the Vanities) a man in possession of an apple of eden (Again, I forget his name) took control of the city of Firenze. He was technically beloved, as he used the apple to manipulate the people into loving him. However, Ezio took him down, by killing all of his advisers, and subsequently killing him.
Sorry for any necromancy.
Forgot to add this was in Assassin’s Creed II.
@link4799
welcome to the site
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As for necromancy, we’re not that big as long as something can be brought to the table new or points can be settled.
So Aragorn wins this then?
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And yes, you can bump threads, but only when you actually bring up something new or something debateable
@Stealth
actually this match was never really settled. The main argument was would the Assassins be able to manipulate the populace as is their standard motive in this situation, or should they even be allowed the opportunity to do so.
Which was never decided really.
@Dark God of Chaos
Or you know, just bored.
“So Aragorn wins this then?
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And yes, you can bump threads, but only when you actually bring up something new or something debateable”
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This is FP, one of the best things about it is “there are no dead threads, only threads that will not die”.
pretty much. though threads not dying isn’t always a bad thing.
(Reads OP)
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….Well, first question, will he have food taken to him, or can they just dick around while he starves to death?
I’m assuming he has servants bringing them food, defeats the purpose of the guards and all if they all starve to death.
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I believe us Assassin defenders had said the assassins will take advantage of Aragorn’s sudden paranoia and take advantage of the criminal element all in order to turn the people against Aragorn and cause a riot to give them a chance to nail Aragorn.
No civilization likes it when their king starts seeing assassins in every shadow and hides in his throne room like a coward. Especially when said king is a former war hero and the last time someone in that bloodline acted weird it was because he snatched an artifact of the Dark Lord.
@GuardianAngel1911
“pretty much. though threads not dying isn’t always a bad thing.”
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Didn’t say it was, I’m *still* trying to necro “WoT Vs WHF”.
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Sadly my search for a WHF fan willy to debate it against WoT hasn’t had much luck…..
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(looks at link4799)
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You wouldn’t happen to know anything about ether would you?
@GuardianAngel1911
“I believe us Assassin defenders had said the assassins will take advantage of Aragorn’s sudden paranoia and take advantage of the criminal element all in order to turn the people against Aragorn and cause a riot to give them a chance to nail Aragorn.
No civilization likes it when their king starts seeing assassins in every shadow and hides in his throne room like a coward. Especially when said king is a former war hero and the last time someone in that bloodline acted weird it was because he snatched an artifact of the Dark Lord.”
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Seems to me that it should be easier for Assassins like them(don’t know the, myself, never played the game, but I’d guess they were at least somewhat good at what they do) to sneak in as one of the servants, as the fact that he’s going to be in that room until ether he or they are dead, means that a *lot* of servants are going to be going in and out of it.
@Shgon
Oh, okay, way you said it I wasn’t sure so wanted to cover the bases.
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and know what, fuck it, I might as well debate this, better than reexplaining how Dresden crushes a Potterverse wizard like a cockroach.
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as of the Altair Ezio Conner match we now know that Ezio’s standard loadout consists of Ishak Pasha’s armor, Yusuf’s Kijil/Kilij and all.
Atair has his legendary armor and sword.
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As for the servant disguise thing I believe that was shot down earlier on.
@GuardianAngel1911
)
“As for the servant disguise thing I believe that was shot down earlier on.”
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then I’m guessing “poisoning the food” was also covered? And people did remember that people bringing food wouldn’t be the only ones coming in right?(just of the top of my head, someone has to change the chamberpots)
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Well…. How good are they at making poison smoke bombs?(mainly trying to think of ways “he *can’t* leave the room” can be used to their advantage at the moment
I don’t think poisoning food was discussed, the argument for the Aragorn side quickly went, to he sends all half his army to raid the city looking for new people and the other half cram in the throne room or all but a few troops raid the city looking for new people.
Which is why we started arguing that the Assassin’s aren’t dumbasses and would use time and tactics and Aragorns sudden fear and paranoia to build a base of allies much like Ezio did in Rome.
Which led to pretty well the entire thread becoming, yes they can no they can’t back and forth.
@GuardianAngel1911
) then “I want my entire army to be with me in this room 24/7″….),
“Which led to pretty well the entire thread becoming, yes they can no they can’t back and forth.”
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This too is FP…. Sadly.
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Nothing says they can’t just leave for a few weeks until everything dies down a little.
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If I was Aragorn, I’d just forget about searching for then, and just lay a trap(hopefully something a little less…. “Sneaky”(
@Shgon
this was our argument, that the second Aragorn starts saying “anyone who finds these people who may or may not exist that I believe want to kill me will get a reward, just give the information to the heavily armed bands of guards that will be breaking into your home to search it”
King or not, after Sauron and all, if Aragorn goes paranoid…..they will suddenly be susceptible to Ezio and Altair saying “hey, look, the king’s gone nuts, he is abusing his power, we should rise up to stop him.”
Since there’s no set timeline Ezio and Altair have all the time in the world to run around Middle Earth, gathering some aid to distract Aragorn’s forces (it was stated that Aragorn has his armies working on conquering other turfs) hell maybe even just piss off some Rohiriam and get them to distract Aragorn.
@shgon Ezio is a pretty good bomb-maker.
@link4799
“Ezio is a pretty good bomb-maker.”
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Well then, how good are they at a little “nighttime rock climbing”?
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I seem to remember the throne room having windows….
climbing to the throne room would/should be pretty damn easy.
“Well then, how good are they at a little “nighttime rock climbing”?”
They invented it. xD
@Dr. Doctor
there’s that too.
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slightly off topic but when I went back and reread your posts I heard them in David Tennants voice.
“climbing to the throne room would/should be pretty damn easy.”
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Well then… Sneak into city, climb up to wendow in the mettle of the night, throw in a bomb of somekind, and leave.
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If the king isn’t dead, just try something else.
they aren’t allowed to kill with ranged weapons in this fight, not Aragorn anyway.
“they aren’t allowed to kill with ranged weapons in this fight, not Aragorn anyway.”
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Well then… they need to get alll those guards out of there, and as that’s likely a lot of guards… How hard would it be for then to sneak in, and set up one of the rooms to explode?
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Ether as a detraction to clear the room, or to lure the guards to their deaths in.
“slightly off topic but when I went back and reread your posts I heard them in David Tennants voice.”
That’s awesome xD
@Dr. Doctor
Very, especially the moments where you verbally smacked people down, which I read in the Doctor’s calm godly rage voice.
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further off topic, but…damnit DT is an epic actor.
@Shgon
I believe that may have been discussed on the first page.