Brought to you by Akelz7
Zerg: Pre SC2, but post Brood War.
Vs.
The Warcraft Universe per the end of Warcraft 3.
Battle takes place in the entirety of the Warcraft Universe, where the Zerg have a 100 year supply of resources to back them up, with pockets of resources also scattered throughout the Nether.
Which side would win?
This will eventually become a battle between the Burning Legion/Scourge and the Zerg.
-
Do the factions of Warcraft 3 even have the weapons, save of course magic, that can hurt the Zerg?
-
Terran Bunkers are fortresses that can take a hell of a lot of punishment.
It needs to because the things they face out there, mainly the Zerg, can dish out pain like nothing in the Warcraft universe can.
-
The only thing I can see going for the Zerg right now is if the races of Warcraft did the same thing to Kerrigan what they did to Archimonde.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=66m8sQY4pNg
-
Now all they’re left with is a mass of ravenous mindless killing machines that, while easier to fight because they have no master, can nonetheless ravage the land bare.
Edit:
Only thing I can see going to the races of Warcraft right now if they did the same thing they did to Archimonde.
Magic is warcrafts only saving grace her, and even then…
-
Anyway I hate them both so I’m hoping one of the 2 sides gets completely obliterated or they wipe eachother out.
-
here*
If Chuck Norris or Mr T is involved I dunno if the Zerg stands a chance. If they aren’t then the Zerg should win easily.
OMG Expert!
Chuck Norris plays the Chuck Norris race on Starcraft.
Mr. T is here, so it’ll be fine, right?
Did they canonize the Mr.T/Norris commercials? Sorry, I don’t know much about WarCraft, though if I had to guess I’d say the Zerg probably outnumber the WC universe.
Well there are some being in Warcraft-universe that can poke the Swarm a bit – Deathwing, Alexstrasza – in fact all dragons Dragons – Demi-Gods, Titans and some badass Demons. Not to forget the Elementals – Especially Ragnaros – as you may have notices Zerg are quite sensible to fire…
Don’t know if it’s enough, but worth a thought!
And then der also is James T. Kirk ( www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CuABcnWXqo&feature=fvst )
I’m going to side with Warcraft. They have the Burning Legion on their side, multiple Gods, The Legion of Damned meaning for every Zerg that falls Warcraft’s ranks are bolstered, and very powerful magics. The Warcraft legions have never faced anything like the Zerg however the Zerg have never faced anything like Warcraft. I assume they are confined to one planet correct?
Also the Zerg according to Shadow of The Xel’Naga can be killed with farming implements. So I think swords, spears, axes, warhammers, etc etc many of which are buffered with magic should be able to kill the zerg just fine.
wow has ozzy
The Zerg or Warcraft? The Zerg will basically start on… let’s say a series of 5 planets with no connection to the others in the Warcraft universe that can be exploited by use of magic, and that 100 years worth is stashed there. The Zerg have to conquer the entire universe, but We’ll give each planet a force the size of the one on Char to begin… That clarify? (Also how is it for my first suggestion?)
Also I’m still on the fence. Azeroth and Draenor are both boned, no question, but the Legion is what poses the significant threat here in my humble opinion.
“The Zerg or Warcraft? The Zerg will basically start on… let’s say a series of 5 planets with no connection to the others in the Warcraft universe that can be exploited by use of magic, and that 100 years worth is stashed there. The Zerg have to conquer the entire universe, but We’ll give each planet a force the size of the one on Char to begin… That clarify? (Also how is it for my first suggestion?)”
-
And how exactly does Warcraft transfer from one planet to another in mass? The lack space ships. Just make it on one planet with an invasion force of zerg and Warcraft has to repel them.
“Also I’m still on the fence. Azeroth and Draenor are both boned, no question, but the Legion is what poses the significant threat here in my humble opinion.”
-
Not Azeroth due to the Legion of The Dead and Arthas’ guidance of them. By the end of Warcraft 3 he was a demigod after all and the Legion of The Dead made up the vast majority of the population by that time.
“And how exactly does Warcraft transfer from one planet to another in mass? The lack space ships. Just make it on one planet with an invasion force of zerg and Warcraft has to repel them.”
Well Warcraft DOEs have spaceships (The Exodar is a prime example) and they can create portals to places in the universe (The Dark Portal). As for the suggestion, there are so many different entities and realms of existence (paraphrasing here) in Warcraft that confining them all to one planet both cheapens the universe and, honestly, makes it MUCH easier for the Zerg, I mean MUCH easier.
-
“Not Azeroth due to the Legion of The Dead and Arthas’ guidance of them. By the end of Warcraft 3 he was a demigod after all and the Legion of The Dead made up the vast majority of the population by that time.”
Fair point. Draenor on the otherhand I don’t have faith in, unless they shut down the Dark Portal.
At the end of Warcraft 3?
-
Does this mean that this is just the time period in the Warcraft universe? Or that we should assume that the only things to be used by Warcraft in this fight must have made an appearance/been used prior to the end of Warcraft 3? Does this include The Frozen Throne?
-
If we are using Warcraft 3 to define the troop numbers, technology and state of affairs of Warcraft, but things only revealed in WoW and beyond are allowed then:
-
Bronze Dragonflight solos. Time travel trumps everything.
-
Along with the other Dragonflights, Deathwing, the Burning Legion, the Naa’ru, the Titans, the Old Ones, the Elemental Lords and their armies, the Lich King, Illidan, the Ahn’qiraji , Stormrage and the rest, Warcraft is unstoppable.
-
Think on it, no matter what fight Warcraft loses the Bronze Dragonflight can rearrange time to fix it. No matter what troops they lose the Lich King will reanimate it, goes for Zerg too. The Old Ones will corrupt the physic Overlords (is that the correct term?) of the Zerg. You get the idea.
-
However if we are using Warcraft 3 (with or without The Frozen Throne Expansion) and its predecessors as the be all and end all of what Warcraft has then the Zerg win easily.
-
Though would it be cheeky to point out the the Warcraft 3 map editor allowed for the addition of both Terran Marines and Zerg units? So technically Warcraft 3 gets both the Zerg and Terran factions aswell…. /Justsaying
“If we are using Warcraft 3 to define the troop numbers, technology and state of affairs of Warcraft, but things only revealed in WoW and beyond are allowed then:”
-
Sorry this made no sense at this point in my post.
-
Correct version:
-
If we are only using Warcraft 3 to define the time period in the Warcraft universe but things only revealed in WoW and beyond are allowed as long as they were around back then:
@Reaper 273
Frozen Throne is included, and we have all of the things we LEARNED about what was already in the Warcraft universe thanks to WoW, but we don’t have any concrete things from WoW. For example, in WoW we discovered C’Thun, who existed pre-WoW. We killed him. However, WoW isn’t in account here, so team WC gets a living C’Thun. Make sense?
-
For the Bronze Dargonflight, unless it’s PIS, which I highly doubt (and I LOVE Nozdormu I know a lot about the guy), The Bronze Flight isn’t going to change the outcome of time, they don’t do that. They assure that things go the way they should.
@akelz7
-
Thanks, yeah that makes sense.
-
Not sure on the Bronze Dragonflight’s refusal to affect time though. If you consider it PIS (to be ignored) then Blizzard wrote them not changing things to stop them from stopping any form of complex threat from forming.
-
Though even if you consider it CIS (which would still be in play) then you would have to think about the fact the as far as the Bronze Dragonflight is concerned time has been altered. Nozdormu was stated somewhere (I really can’t remember where) to know the time of his own death, meaning the future and past are both already set in the Warcraft universe (we just don’t know what it is yet).
-
This means that the Zerg entering the Warcraft universe would constitute a change in the timeline which the Bronze Dragonflight would then be free to use all force necessary to repair, via the eradication of the Zerg.
@Reaper
Fair point. Too bad the Bronze Flight alone, no matter how mighty and time-alter-y, can’t realistically handle the Zerg… like at all… especially in the form I have them starting in (5 Chars that can last 20 years each). They can’t even get there (yet, as I stated), so the Zerg get he offensive. The best use I see for them is strategy since they can report assaults before they happen. This is essentially a “Can the Zerg conquer Warcraft in 100 years or so, with let’s say 100 more years worth of resources scattered throughout the universe. (Sorry, I should have clarified that… I was in a hurry to even suggest…)
-
So to clarify: The Zerg have 5 Char-sized planets with enough resources total to sustain them, at current capacity, for 100 years. Within the overall universe of WC (I believe the Nether is their equivalent to space), random, empty planets have resources enough to last 100 more. The 5 Chars are 100% isolated magically from WC, so no form of teleportation, or time travel, can get team 2 there. The Zerg, essentially, have to conquer the entire WC universe in 200 years.
Well considering the Bronze Dragonflight can inform everyone else well ahead of each attack, as you said, aswell as bringing others through time (they have done this a number of times) their own lack of power isn’t an issue.
-
Both the Burning Crusade and the Naa’ru have shown to have interstellar travel. And though we haven’t seen it the Titans must do aswell. So there are no problems with troop transport.
-
I’m pretty sure the rest of the Warcraft forces such the Titans, the other Dragonflights, the Naaru, the other ‘ill defined’ actual gods (Elune comes to mind), the Demi-Gods like Cenarius, the undead under the Lich King and Arthas (if they don’t choose too merge again) and the rest should be more than enough to hold of the Zerg for eternity.
-
Especially considering that the Bronze could always go and fetch Medihv and Sargeras (before returning them to their actual times and deaths at the end of the match).
@Reaper273
A fair point. Now here’s my question: what would the Zerg do if they got, say , ONE mage. Just one. What could they make? How does Kerrigan factor in here?
I’m not sure on the mage question. Do Zerg absorb knowledge or just genetics?
-
Because whilst mages are born (some kind of genetic factor) most of their power comes from knowledge and experience.
-
If they did capture a mage (and I’m not sure that they would be able to it with the Bronze Dragonflight flying about changing things) would they have to take him/her back to one of their planets for study to utilise? Or would there just be an instant “ooooo, we haz l33t magez now” sort of deal. And a final question if they did capture one and return with it to a planet what sort of distribution speed for this new genetic material are we talking about? As in, would there be time to destroy the material.
-
Though in this case I do feel you are underestimating the advantage of time travel. If the Zerg did get hold of a Mage and survive with the knowledge intact (big IF) and if they were able to make Mages powerful enough to be useful (again, IF). Then the Bronze Dragonflight would become aware of this new threat and ensure that no Mages were ever taken (using some of their more powerful allies I assume) thus preventing the situation from arising.
-
Kerrigan is powerful but not Titan or even Archimonde/Kiljeadon/Medihv powerful I think. Sorry for the spelling on those three by the way. In short Warcraft has individuals on and above her level of power and many more of them compared to the Zergs one.
-
Question on the match, can the Zerg retreat/send back units, for whatever reason, back to the magically sealed worlds they are invading from?
“I’m pretty sure the rest of the Warcraft forces such the Titans, the other Dragonflights, the Naaru, the other ‘ill defined’ actual gods (Elune comes to mind), the Demi-Gods like Cenarius, the undead under the Lich King and Arthas (if they don’t choose too merge again) and the rest should be more than enough to hold of the Zerg for eternity.”
-
Just saying “gods” doesn’t mean much. What kind of power do they have? Because it is going to take quite a lot to take out the Zerg, considering that the basic unit, the zergling, can take hypersonic depleted uranium rounds, or at least a couple. Seriously, the zerg are so far and away stronger than the average units that it is gonna fall on the “gods”, who might not be able to handle the sheer numbers.
-
“Especially considering that the Bronze could always go and fetch Medihv and Sargeras (before returning them to their actual times and deaths at the end of the match).”
-
No time travel before match start.
Well it took them like 2 weeks to turn a semi-acidic fungi into Banelings, and that was on a random planet nobody cares about, too. You make a good point with the time travel, though. I think we need to trash it to get a fair fight, if we even can…
-
GOT IT! Nozdormu said in the Twilight of the Aspects book that there are infinite different futures out there, meaning 1: a huge plot hole with how and when he dies, and 2: a possible counter to your claim the the arrival of the Zerg messes up time enough to warrant Bronze interference, since we DON’T know how the future is supposed to go and Nozdormu’s fate could very well be getting NOM NOM NOMED by Zerg forces.
What about the minerals and gases that Zerg can use to synthesize units? Are any of the native materials compatible with those?
“Just saying “gods” doesn’t mean much. What kind of power do they have? Because it is going to take quite a lot to take out the Zerg, considering that the basic unit, the zergling, can take hypersonic depleted uranium rounds, or at least a couple. Seriously, the zerg are so far and away stronger than the average units that it is gonna fall on the “gods”, who might not be able to handle the sheer numbers.”
Well the Gods in warcraft are physically not much a force to reckoned with against, say, an Ultralisk, let alone a Brutalisk (come to think of it what DO the Zerg exactly get since it’s pre SC2… GALORIAN!), but they love MAGIC… very powerful magic. World-breaking magic… However stuff like that is DRAINING (and I’m not talking GM here, magic takes a lot out of you), and against a large enough horde might not be enough.
-
Yeah we are going to need some hard numbers here, I’ll start my research after a nice tasty meal.
“What about the minerals and gases that Zerg can use to synthesize units? Are any of the native materials compatible with those?”
No, but the Zerg have enough to sustain (that is, replace casualties) for 100 years, and an additional 100 years of resources lies throughout the Nether. With basic knowledge, team 2 will probably guard these places heavily.
“but they love MAGIC… very powerful magic. World-breaking magic… ”
-
I played Warcraft 3, and I don’t remember anyone having planet-busting magic. In fact, the magic didn’t seem that strong at all, to be honest. But we’ll have to see about the WoW gods.
-
BTW, how much punishment can the Warcraft gods take? The numbers the Zerg have are staggering, and unless their defense is very, very high, they’re gonna get beat.
“I played Warcraft 3, and I don’t remember anyone having planet-busting magic. In fact, the magic didn’t seem that strong at all, to be honest. But we’ll have to see about the WoW gods.”
Most powerful magic is saved for books and backstory, I’m afraid. Remember that scene with Archimonde, sand castles, and Dalaran? Not unique in terms of power.
-
“BTW, how much punishment can the Warcraft gods take? The numbers the Zerg have are staggering, and unless their defense is very, very high, they’re gonna get beat.”
Well Cenarius literally couldn’t get hurt by Grom and his forces until they drank the demon blood to become powerful enough to hurt him, so there are magical barriers that the Zerg will have to overcome via absorption of WC foes.
@Aelfinn
-
“Just saying “gods” doesn’t mean much. What kind of power do they have? Because it is going to take quite a lot to take out the Zerg, considering that the basic unit, the zergling, can take hypersonic depleted uranium rounds, or at least a couple. Seriously, the zerg are so far and away stronger than the average units that it is gonna fall on the “gods”, who might not be able to handle the sheer numbers.”
-
So far it’s actually just Elune that has been defined as an actual ‘god’ so god’s may have been a mistake on my part.
-
Indeed footsoldier to footsoldier, flyer to flyer, tank to tank like bug the Zerg win without a doubt. But it’s the other Warcraft ‘things’ that turn the tides.
-
How will the Zerg be able to damage an elemental being such as Ragnaros or Neptulon, let alone withstand their attacks?
-
What can the do to resist manipulation and corruption by the Old God’s? (Not actual gods, just beings powerful enough to be considered un-killable by the Titans.)
-
What can they do against all the fallen (Warcraft and Zerg) being raised again and augmented as undead by the Lich King?
-
What can they do against the Lich Kings telepathic control? (In this case it would actually come down to which mind control is stronger).
-
What would they be able to do to counter the Bronze Dragonflight from predicting their every move? (Not an issue if akelz7 has banned time travel.)
-
What would they be able to do to stop the Naa’ru attacking with the full power of the Light behind them? (Note Light, with a capital L. Holy Power.)
-
What happens when Deathwing goes apeshit on them?
-
What defence have they against the power of the Dragon Soul?
-
The Burning Legion? (Granted grunt for grunt we are talking Zerg win, but power scales massively with rank in the Legion.)
-
What defence do they have against Mages, and magic in general?
-
All of the above pales before the fact that the Titans are more powerful than all of the above and are still around and kick starting civilisations.
-
A though on materials. Warcraft materials are hardly regular steel and iron. Warcraft weaponry goes from Copper, Bronze, Iron, Steel, Mithril, Dark Iron, Thorium, Fel Iron, Adamantium, Cobalt, Saronite, Obsidium and Elementium. Each is stronger than the last. Elemtentium should logically be at least somewhat effective armour, and weaponry, against the Zerg.
-
“No time travel before match start.”
-
Ah yes, fair point. That was just an afterthought.
-
@akelz7
-
So effectively, if Warcraft can keep the Zerg bottled up they only have to hold out for 100 years because the second 100 years worth of resources will have been denied to the Zerg?
@Aelfinn
-
“I played Warcraft 3, and I don’t remember anyone having planet-busting magic. In fact, the magic didn’t seem that strong at all, to be honest. But we’ll have to see about the WoW gods.”
-
Might be you misunderstood the match setup.
-
Warcraft 3 is only the time period for the Warcraft universe.
-
Things that existed at that time but were only elaborated on in WoW can be used.
-
And tbf the planet Draenor was physically shattered by the Orks by the use of massive amounts of magical energies in Warcraft 2.
“How will the Zerg be able to damage an elemental being such as Ragnaros or Neptulon, let alone withstand their attacks?”
-
That depends. What are they made of? Can they be hurt? What hurts them?
-
“What can the do to resist manipulation and corruption by the Old God’s? (Not actual gods, just beings powerful enough to be considered un-killable by the Titans.)”
-
I need parameters on this power. The Zerg Hive Mind could resist them based on this.
-
“What can they do against all the fallen (Warcraft and Zerg) being raised again and augmented as undead by the Lich King?”
-
Attack and kill them again. Just like everyone from the Warcraft Universe.
-
“What can they do against the Lich Kings telepathic control? (In this case it would actually come down to which mind control is stronger).”
-
As far as I know, Zerg Hive Mind > Lich King.
-
“What would they be able to do to counter the Bronze Dragonflight from predicting their every move? (Not an issue if akelz7 has banned time travel.)”
-
Not gonna do squat if the Zerg win every engagement anyway.
-
“What would they be able to do to stop the Naa’ru attacking with the full power of the Light behind them? (Note Light, with a capital L. Holy Power.)”
-
I need parameters.
-
“What happens when Deathwing goes apeshit on them?”
-
Overwhelm him. The Zerg have Billions of Soldiers. Probably more.
-
“The Burning Legion? (Granted grunt for grunt we are talking Zerg win, but power scales massively with rank in the Legion.)”
-
How numerous are the Burning Legion? They probably don’t have Billions.
-
“What defence do they have against Mages, and magic in general?”
-
Considering how the magic in Warcraft is pretty weaksauce (admittedly, from what I remember), they should do just fine.
-
“Each is stronger than the last. Elemtentium should logically be at least somewhat effective armour, and weaponry, against the Zerg.”
-
How prevalent is it?
-
“All of the above pales before the fact that the Titans are more powerful than all of the above and are still around and kick starting civilisations.”
-
How strong are they? I need parameters.
“Might be you misunderstood the match setup.
-
Warcraft 3 is only the time period for the Warcraft universe.
-
Things that existed at that time but were only elaborated on in WoW can be used.”
-
I understood it fine. I know what is happening, I was just using Warcraft 3 for my experience.
-
“And tbf the planet Draenor was physically shattered by the Orks by the use of massive amounts of magical energies in Warcraft 2.”
-
The planet was shattered because of the sheer amount of portals they put all over the planet in an attempt to escape. Quite a slow process.
“That depends. What are they made of? Can they be hurt? What hurts them?”
-
Neptulon is made of water and Ragnaros of Fire.
-
“I need parameters on this power. The Zerg Hive Mind could resist them based on this.”
-
I implied something similar with regards to the Lich King’s mental powers. However resisting and resisting successfully are two entirely different things.
-
“Attack and kill them again. Just like everyone from the Warcraft Universe.”
-
And then they get raised again, with perhaps just a few more dead-Zerg the second time around. Even more the third. And then the fourth and so on and so on.
-
“As far as I know, Zerg Hive Mind > Lich King.”
-
I think some proof of that is required.
-
Zerg Hive Mind is limited in range (at least to some extent) and can be (at least as far as I can remember) disrupted by killing the building/units broadcasting it.
-
“Not gonna do squat if the Zerg win every engagement anyway.”
-
That has yet to be proved.
-
“I need parameters.” RE – Holy Power.
-
Pretty much is what it says on the tin. Has the potential to be more powerful than the most powerful magics. Think re-igniting the sunwell and curing (or at least releasing) that Paladin in Icecrown from undeath where very powerful Druid’s and the Dragon Aspect of Life had failed.
-
In terms of raw power? Unknown it’s a fantasy game. They aren’t big on easy calculable events.
-
“Overwhelm him. The Zerg have Billions of Soldiers. Probably more.”
-
They won’t all be in one place and Deathwing can just perform fly bys. Not to mention this is a fight between the Zerg and the Warcraft ‘heroes’ for want of a better word strolling one by one. They will all be there at once making overwhelming by numbers difficult.
-
Also this is Deathwing:
-
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wq4Y7ztznKc
-
Hardly weak….
-
“How numerous are the Burning Legion? They probably don’t have Billions.”
-
They are considered innumerable. So yes, Billions. But as I said the Burning Legions main strength is their is the exceptionally powerful lieutenants, captains and generals (not their actual ranks but you get the idea) that will cause the problems.
-
They also have tanks, energy canons and 100 feet tall mechanical melee mechs.
-
“Considering how the magic in Warcraft is pretty weaksauce (admittedly, from what I remember), they should do just fine.”
-
www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOP-VtThmVU
-
www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCr7y4SLhck
-
Not to mention the Orks shattering Draenor with the Portals.
-
Hardly weaksauce.
-
“How prevalent is it?”
-
Going by the games, in unlimited quantities.
-
In practice, more than enough to arm and armour the hereos.
-
As I said Warcraft won’t win by going toe to toe with each Zerg. Rather by utilising their much more powerful high end heavy hitters to take out thousands at a time.
-
“How strong are they? I need parameters.”
-
They each have their own area of expertise some were mages others melee hitters.
-
Put it this way. The video I linked of the destruction of Dalaran (www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOP-VtThmVU). Was done by a corrupt Titans lieutenant without any effort. That should give a rough idea of a single Titans power. Now multiply that by an entire race’s worth of Titans.
“What would they be able to do to counter the Bronze Dragonflight from predicting their every move? (Not an issue if akelz7 has banned time travel.)”
I haven’t banned it, it has been disproven as a factor.
-
“How will the Zerg be able to damage an elemental being such as Ragnaros or Neptulon, let alone withstand their attacks?”
-
“So effectively, if Warcraft can keep the Zerg bottled up they only have to hold out for 100 years because the second 100 years worth of resources will have been denied to the Zerg?”
Giant ‘if’ there, and in a minute I’m going to make that ‘if’ a LOT bigger.
-
“What can the do to resist manipulation and corruption by the Old God’s? (Not actual gods, just beings powerful enough to be considered un-killable by the Titans.)
-
What can they do against all the fallen (Warcraft and Zerg) being raised again and augmented as undead by the Lich King?”
The answer to both is that neither force works in psionics, and that is how the new WC abilities the Zerg gains are going to be integrated into the swarm.
“Me thinks the same way the player does: magic. The Zerg can and WILL get it, and abuse it thoroughly.
-
“What can they do against all the fallen (Warcraft and Zerg) being raised again and augmented as undead by the Lich King?”
Well they can eat them, too! And possibly learn how to resurrect their fallen…
-
“What would they be able to do to stop the Naa’ru attacking with the full power of the Light behind them? (Note Light, with a capital L. Holy Power.)”
Kill the Naa’ru with the 3,000 zerglings NOT being hit by light powers?
-
“The Burning Legion? (Granted grunt for grunt we are talking Zerg win, but power scales massively with rank in the Legion.)”
They are effectively the other side of the match-up., however they are a non-factor on Azeroth. Since this is galactic conquest we’re going to be going through stages, and Azeroth/Darenor is stage one.
-
“What defence do they have against Mages, and magic in general?”
Mages are brittle and can get snapped in half like twigs by Hydra spines if they so much as blink. The zerg can take, and integrate, them rather quickly.
-
“What happens when Deathwing goes apeshit on them?
-
What defence have they against the power of the Dragon Soul?”
1: The Dragon Soul is destroyed. GONE. Nozdormu got it in the Cata expansion from the past.
2: Deathwing is, if anything, going to LOSE Azeroth for Team 2. I’ll explain.Deathwing, as of WC3, is in Deepholm recovering from the ass-whooping he got the last he showed his face on Azeroth. Based on what I know of the WoW timeline I’m thinking he’ll take about 15 years to get powerful enough to emerge, and bring about the Cataclysm. IT will rock the fortresses of team 2, but the Zerg won’t even blink at it. Hives are pretty sturdy there. So the Zerg are going to quickly be able to abuse the chaos of the Cataclysm to demolish Team 2′s strongholds, and Azeroth will really just be in the hands of any survivors of that onslaught, Deathwing, the Elemental Lords, and their realms.
-
“A though on materials. Warcraft materials are hardly regular steel and iron. Warcraft weaponry goes from Copper, Bronze, Iron, Steel, Mithril, Dark Iron, Thorium, Fel Iron, Adamantium, Cobalt, Saronite, Obsidium and Elementium. Each is stronger than the last. Elemtentium should logically be at least somewhat effective armour, and weaponry, against the Zerg.”
Well how hard is the rare Elementium that won’t be discovered for 15 years until the areas containing it are revealed by Deathwing?
-
“How numerous are the Burning Legion? They probably don’t have Billions.”
They don’t have billions, they have a fuckton more. I’m not sure there are solid numbers, we’ll need an expert in here to make estimates.
-
“All of the above pales before the fact that the Titans are more powerful than all of the above and are still around and kick starting civilisations.”
The Hive Mind, given the information it’ll have by the time the inactive as fuck Titans get to doing anything, (they literally have done nothing since the Legion began… NOTHING) can… deal with it. Me thinks they can make a Leviathan-esque creature of titanic power…
-
I’m wondering if the Zerg will, with enough consumption of WC natives, be able to feast of off the resources there…
“Just saying “gods” doesn’t mean much. What kind of power do they have? Because it is going to take quite a lot to take out the Zerg, considering that the basic unit, the zergling, can take hypersonic depleted uranium rounds, or at least a couple. Seriously, the zerg are so far and away stronger than the average units that it is gonna fall on the “gods”, who might not be able to handle the sheer numbers.”
-
You mean the same Zerg that were also killed by farming implements? Man to man you average soldier should be able to kill them with weapons actually designed to kill and which one again are buffered by magic both internal and buffered by outside heroes.
-
Besides that though the magic may be weak sauce compared to others like say Diablo or Forgotten Realms but compared to Starcraft it basically unheard of.
-
So examples of powerful magic users include the Lich with their cryomancer abilities and Death and Decay one of the most powerful spells in the Undead arsenal
-
The aphotic, swirling clouds conjured by the Death Knights can cause anything within their path to rot and decompose. The vapor created by Decay can consume anything – flesh, bone, wood or even the strongest metal. Heavily laden with base substances, these clouds descend and quickly diffuse, leaving only suffering in their wake.[2]
The swirling negative energies known as the Death And Decay spell are favored by the liches for their power to decompose, rot and destroy everything within them. Not even the strongest warriors or the most durable structures can stand the full effects of Death And Decay.[3]
Negative energy infuses the area in visible puffs. Living creatures age rapidly, as skin sags and flesh sloughs off bones. Structures wither and collapse, suffering the effects of decades within a few seconds. All living creatures and non-natural structures in the area take damage from the negative energy. Since undead are powered by negative energy, this spell cures them a like amount of damage.[4]
-
This spell would basically destroy an entire wave while bolstering the Undead forces which are plentiful and will stack as the Zerg take casualties.
The Zerg have a massive flying army, you know? They may not have the almighty Mutas, but it’s not a billion Zerglings fighting this war. What’s the range of a Hydra again? What’s the rate of fire? I mean just a few hundred of them can turn the tide easily in any ground war with non-titans.
wonder how zerg vs slivers(magic the gathering) would go down
@fallstar
MTG…. MTG isn’t fit for Factpile. At all.
“MTG…. MTG isn’t fit for Factpile. At all.”
why not
“The Zerg have a massive flying army, you know? They may not have the almighty Mutas, but it’s not a billion Zerglings fighting this war. What’s the range of a Hydra again? What’s the rate of fire? I mean just a few hundred of them can turn the tide easily in any ground war with non-titans.”
-
They have fliers but so do we. And ours can turn into stone or are dragons and undead dragons that breath fire and ice or demons and what not or Phoenixs.
-
As for the Hydralisk its spines will be next to useless against a zombie. They are not fighting for hitpoints here. Zombies are already dead thus its organs are no longer functioning so a few dozen spines are not going to kill a whole lot. Plus there’s the fact that most of the undead lieutenants mostly have magic that bolsters the speed and strength of their ranks. For example a Death Knight at level 3 can bolster their men’s speed by 30% and heal them as well. So the ghouls, which are already fast, will be faster by 30% as well as heal from all none fatal damage. Paladins can do this as well with living beings.
@fallstar
MTG is so insubstantial and unquantifiable. There is little to no back-story on anything other than a few Planeswalkers. I mean with MTG you can, rather easily, destroy Thanos, Dr. Mahattan, Sargeras, and a bunch of other really powerful folks with one spell (damnation).
@Akelz7
meh.
theres also like 20+ books to pull from but i can see your point.
some thing could be used phaerun( the time mage planeswalker) for example
“They have fliers but so do we. And ours can turn into stone or are dragons and undead dragons that breath fire and ice or demons and what not or Phoenixs”
None of this impresses me enough to think that the Zerg lack air superiority. I mean a few thousand scourge alone should hold for several hours.
-
“As for the Hydralisk its spines will be next to useless against a zombie. They are not fighting for hitpoints here. Zombies are already dead thus its organs are no longer functioning so a few dozen spines are not going to kill a whole lot. Plus there’s the fact that most of the undead lieutenants mostly have magic that bolsters the speed and strength of their ranks. For example a Death Knight at level 3 can bolster their men’s speed by 30% and heal them as well. So the ghouls, which are already fast, will be faster by 30% as well as heal from all none fatal damage. Paladins can do this as well with living beings.”
That’s assuming that the only enemies the Zerg will be fighting are Scourge. Not so. All of the living, fleshy enemies are very vulnerable to the spines, and the few that aren’t (mages, paladins) won’t be able to outlast many waves, and will fall. And it’s not like the Zerg just leave the dead to rot, they’ll put them to use before, or hell after Arthas does. And the DK speed thing, can you get a non GM source on that? Every casualty for the WC side is subject to Zerg assimilation, and they will happen. Let’s see how many hypersonic spines to the neck red drakes/dragons/hell even wyrms can take.
-
Again I’m calling for someone with expertise to give us some concrete numbers here, those aren’t what I’m good for.
“heres also like 20+ books to pull from but i can see your point.
some thing could be used phaerun( the time mage planeswalker) for example”
If it’s any consolation, my next suggestion is going to have Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker in it.. PRE-MENDING.
“None of this impresses me enough to think that the Zerg lack air superiority. I mean a few thousand scourge alone should hold for several hours.”
-
Based off the fact that the Zerg wouldn’t even be able to get near a pheonix is pretty impressive.
-
“That’s assuming that the only enemies the Zerg will be fighting are Scourge. Not so. All of the living, fleshy enemies are very vulnerable to the spines, and the few that aren’t (mages, paladins) won’t be able to outlast many waves, and will fall. And it’s not like the Zerg just leave the dead to rot, they’ll put them to use before, or hell after Arthas does. And the DK speed thing, can you get a non GM source on that? Every casualty for the WC side is subject to Zerg assimilation, and they will happen. Let’s see how many hypersonic spines to the neck red drakes/dragons/hell even wyrms can take.”
-
The Scourge is a bigger threat then the humans. Remember by the time of Frozen Throne the population was mostly undead. Humans are the minority in this match.
-
As for the Zerg putting the bodies to use first Death Knights and Liches can and will raise the bodies on the field as they fall on both sides.
-
And as for the Wyrms of a few needles to the neck will not stop them because they are dead already. However the Frost Wyrm can destroy entire legions worth of Zerg with their ice blasts.
-
One of the main reasons why I am on the side of Warcraft is their buffers and magic. For example Dreadlords have the ability to grant Vampiric Aura which gives all under its effect to drain the energies of those they attack and heal themselves with it. Zerg don’t have the same scale of unit buffering abilities.
@Midnite
Wyrm is a classification of size. The Aspects are Wyrms. Wyrm =/= dead. As for the rest I’ve got nothing CURRENTLY, research is a bitch.
“Wyrm is a classification of size. The Aspects are Wyrms. Wyrm =/= dead. As for the rest I’ve got nothing CURRENTLY, research is a bitch.”
-
I’m talking about those that are raised by the undead. I’ll get to the other later.
A little side note here, if the Zerg can assault the Frozen Throne and kill Arthas (if they focus solely on him they can), the Scourge become a neutral threat, attacking both Teams one and 2 unless two can get a Lich King… or, imagine if Kerrgian takes the crown…
To the person mentioning the farming implements thing: Shut up.
-
People have long been regurgitating that hyperbole and using it to counteract ALL the rest of the durability feats for the zerg.
-
Those farming implements were tools designed to CUT LARGE STONES. These were ROCK farmers.
-
Even if we assumed that they were pitchforks, which you are doing here, we still have countless more demonstrations of zerg resilience the least of which is zerglings here taking hundreds of HYPERSONIC 8mm rounds.
-
www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GMOTrIjVao
-
and here we have an ultralisk tanking a siege tank shell
-
www.youtube.com/watch?v=mk17xA-JM3k&t=120s
-
and you clearly see it stepping into the direction the explosion occurred from.
Also, the zerg aren’t limited to throwing spikes and they do have large claws for cleaving and shredding enemies such as undead.
-
And dragons will have a tough time with scourge, which take down capital ships in a few hits. When they explode it’s an actual bio-plasma explosion.
-
That said, I think warcraft wins this fight. The zerg have no real counter for their magic!. Even if kerrigan is involved, she’s a lot weaker than some of the baddies in wc3
“Put it this way. The video I linked of the destruction of Dalaran (www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOP-VtThmVU). Was done by a corrupt Titans lieutenant without any effort. That should give a rough idea of a single Titans power. Now multiply that by an entire race’s worth of Titans.”
-
He had to spend the time to make that symbol in the dirt, and it only destroyed one city. When dealing with an inter-planetary race of billions, that IS weaksauce.
-
“You mean the same Zerg that were also killed by farming implements? Man to man you average soldier should be able to kill them with weapons actually designed to kill and which one again are buffered by magic both internal and buffered by outside heroes.”
-
That was from one book out of the entire expanded universe, and it is widely regarded as inaccurate. Are we just going to ignore how they can withstand hypersonic 8mm rounds?
-
“They are considered innumerable. So yes, Billions. ”
-
Innumerable to a fantasy/medieval culture. This could easily be in the millions, or even hundreds of thousands, considering medieval wars were fought with hundreds.
-
“As for the Hydralisk its spines will be next to useless against a zombie. They are not fighting for hitpoints here. Zombies are already dead thus its organs are no longer functioning so a few dozen spines are not going to kill a whole lot. ”
-
The Hydralisk spines take out Marines in armor designed to take the hypersonic rounds.
-
“One of the main reasons why I am on the side of Warcraft is their buffers and magic. For example Dreadlords have the ability to grant Vampiric Aura which gives all under its effect to drain the energies of those they attack and heal themselves with it. Zerg don’t have the same scale of unit buffering abilities.”
-
The scale of the Zerg is so much larger than Warcraft is why I am on Starcraft’s side. The unit buffering abilities just won’t have the impact needed.
-
“That said, I think warcraft wins this fight. The zerg have no real counter for their magic!. ”
-
They have the numbers to deal with the worst magic, and the base magic that is thrown out is simply not strong enough to do too much.
I think that the Zerg will win in part to their absolute physical dominance and numbers, and in part to their adaptability. They CAN make a virus to infect WC creatures, and they CAN take WC creatures, mages in particular, and assimilate them. By CAN I mean ABSOLUTELY WILL, by the way. Also, I believe that they CAN assault and topple the Frozen Throne, making the Scourge a problem for Team 2.
“To the person mentioning the farming implements thing: Shut up.
-
People have long been regurgitating that hyperbole and using it to counteract ALL the rest of the durability feats for the zerg.
-
Those farming implements were tools designed to CUT LARGE STONES. These were ROCK farmers.”
-
No. It was canon thus usable. As for them being rock farmers no they were not. You do not farm rock you mine it. One does not use scythes to cut through rocks that’s just stupid. You don’t cut rock you smash through.
-
“Even if we assumed that they were pitchforks, which you are doing here, we still have countless more demonstrations of zerg resilience the least of which is zerglings here taking hundreds of HYPERSONIC 8mm rounds.”
-
Your gassing it.
-
1. that wasn’t hundreds it was 175-180
-
2. It look to me like he missed most the shots and the rest bounced off the head.
-
“Also, the zerg aren’t limited to throwing spikes and they do have large claws for cleaving and shredding enemies such as undead.”"
-
No one said they was. But the Undead are already strong to begin with since they are mutated in death plus they have their strength and speed buffered through magical means.
-
Relax its not that serious.
-
“That was from one book out of the entire expanded universe, and it is widely regarded as inaccurate. Are we just going to ignore how they can withstand hypersonic 8mm rounds?”
-
Only book where the Zerg were explicitly engaged in close combat for a prolonged period. That does not change the fact that this was the Kulkulkan Brood who Kerrigan said was her best. Besides that based off the books and in game movies the rounds seemed to either glance off the skull or over penetrate not doing significant damage. This was prevalent in Speed of Darkness in which Ardo had the rounds switched to do higher surface damage. Does not neglect the fact that farming implements, snub noses, hunting rifles, and double barrel shotguns were seen to do fatal damage.
-
“The Hydralisk spines take out Marines in armor designed to take the hypersonic rounds.”
-
Difference is that Marines are alive thus if their organs are pin cushioned they die. Zombies can be canonically filled with arrows and blades and still keep coming. That’s just a general thing about zombies. They are dead thus they don’t need any organs or to breathe and poison is ineffective. Unless the spike hit with enough force to tear them to pieces, which they don’t since they over penetrate, they aren’t that effective against the undead.
-
“The scale of the Zerg is so much larger than Warcraft is why I am on Starcraft’s side. The unit buffering abilities just won’t have the impact needed.”
-
The amount of Zerg were never mentioned for this match. I’m under the inclination that there are billions of Zerg and each Zerg that falls will be turned against the rest. Then there are mages with the ability to summon elementals otherworldly creatures. And last their are creatures that literally can’t be touched by mortal hands and creatures that engulfed entirely in Fel-Fire. I’m still under the impression that Warcraft can pull this off if allowed to work together.
-
“. They CAN make a virus to infect WC creatures, and they CAN take WC creatures, mages in particular, and assimilate them. By CAN I mean ABSOLUTELY WILL, by the way. Also, I believe that they CAN assault and topple the Frozen Throne, making the Scourge a problem for Team 2.”
-
Magic has to be cast. I doubt Zerg can absorb otherworldly abilities since they cannot even absorb the ability to make Psi-Blades from the Protoss.
“No. It was canon thus usable. As for them being rock farmers no they were not. You do not farm rock you mine it. One does not use scythes to cut through rocks that’s just stupid. You don’t cut rock you smash through.”
As for another hilariously humiliating durability ‘feat’, apparently Zerglings can be killed by hitting them with an ATV moving at a snail’s pace.
The Burning Legion quite possibly has numbers in the trillions at least. It was mentioned that they swarmed entire worlds with pure numbers and THEY are a intergalactic force after all. Kil’ Jaeden could quite possibly destroy anything in his way. It took the World Tree, infused with the Well’s magicks gathered over a few thousand years IIRC to self-destruct to kill Archimonde. Everything else was fodder to him.
-
And I really don’t see how they’ll defeat the Titans and Old Gods. Titans are world creators while the Old Gods turned Deathwing evil through psychic whispers. The Lich King can also ressurect any dead, which is really, really useful.
-
However, the Zerg can swarm nearly anything in their path. Which is…. Useless against magicks in the long run. Kerrigan would get utterly thrashed by any high-tier like Titans, Old Gods, BL’s top with ease, so bringing her in isn’t going to help.
-
For once, the Zerg may actually taste defeat. They’re powerful, but they can’t do anything to even the Elemental Lords.
Physically, the Zerg stomp practically everything in their way.
But once the fight escalates into magical territory, it’s over. Zerg loses.
There was no specified number for the Burning Legion, as there is none for the Zerg.
Both of these factions will face an eternity of conflict (with the Zerg wrecking vast swathes of demons) until the major powers intervene.
That is, Kerrigan, the generals of the Legion, and the Lich King.
“The Burning Legion quite possibly has numbers in the trillions at least. ”
-
No way to prove that. Just because they take over worlds through “sheer numbers” does not mean they have to have trillions.
-
“Difference is that Marines are alive thus if their organs are pin cushioned they die. Zombies can be canonically filled with arrows and blades and still keep coming.”
-
A hypersonic round will turn a zombie into a fine red mist.
-
A hypersonic round such as the ones used by Marines have the strength of tank shells.
-
“Does not neglect the fact that farming implements, snub noses, hunting rifles, and double barrel shotguns were seen to do fatal damage.”
-
And that does not neglect the fact that they take rounds. Obviously it’s inconsistent, and the hypersonic speeds were written by Chris Metzen or some such. The calcs on just how strong it is is over on Terran Marine vs. Imperial Royal Guard.
-
However, I see that the Zerg really don’t have anything to get at the super-high tier of Warcraft entities, even though there has been a complete lack of feats. “Civilization Building” doesn’t quite equal the fighting feats. If some could be given, that would be nice. But, I digress, and WarCraft probably wins this due to the gods.
i wonder if my obould many-arrows vs garrosh hellscream match will get posted
“Besides that though the magic may be weak sauce compared to others like say Diablo or Forgotten Realms but compared to Starcraft it basically unheard of.”
-
Starcraft has magic, it’s just explained differently and has a different theme. The spell you described is kinda like zerg plague or fungal growth mixed or psi storm. Nothing the zerg haven’t seen before.
-
“No. It was canon thus usable.”
Canon can contradict. Newer canon takes precedence over older canon.
-
“One does not use scythes to cut through rocks that’s just stupid. You don’t cut rock you smash through.”
-
lots of stuff in starcraft is stupid. Terrans use thick metal armor and crude dews on their starships. They hadn’t a clue how to make shields, then in a few years they have them on everything from cabinets to battlecruisers doing silly things like letting battlecruisers ram eachother without serious harm.
-
“2. It look to me like he missed most the shots and the rest bounced off the head.”
-
They bounced off. That’s pretty indicative that it’s going to take a lot more firepower to take them down.
-
“No one said they was. But the Undead are already strong to begin with since they are mutated in death plus they have their strength and speed buffered through magical means.”
-
The zerg are also very strong due to their physiology bullshit that they do with everything.
-
“Does not neglect the fact that farming implements, snub noses, hunting rifles, and double barrel shotguns were seen to do fatal damage.”
Hunting rifles are powerful stuff. Compare an elephant gun to an assault rifle.
Terran pistols are occasionally stronger than the c-14 impaler that the marines use. It’s not out of the question that their shotguns or random arms are stronger than the modern day variants. Heck, WC3 features gunpowder weapons that do a decent job if you want to go that route.
Plus, those melee implements are made of a superior metal than what we have. How superior? unfortunately I don’t know.
-
“Zombies can be canonically filled with arrows and blades and still keep coming. That’s just a general thing about zombies. They are dead thus they don’t need any organs or to breathe and poison is ineffective.”
-
Depends on how the magic works. limbs can be taken off, those spines are quite large.
-
“The amount of Zerg were never mentioned for this match. I’m under the inclination that there are billions of Zerg and each Zerg that falls will be turned against the rest”
Unless they win the battle and the other side doesn’t have access to the corpses. Billions is a lot compared to the WC3 world, and the zerg have enough resources in the op for 100 years of invasion.
-
“Magic has to be cast. I doubt Zerg can absorb otherworldly abilities since they cannot even absorb the ability to make Psi-Blades from the Protoss.”
-
The protoss are protected by the fortitude of the khala. That link they have between each other somehow disrupts the infestation process. The overmind only attacked the terran in the hopes of finding psionic potential to build up the zerg’s power.
-
“And last their are creatures that literally can’t be touched by mortal hands and creatures that engulfed entirely in Fel-Fire.”
-
Yeah the higher tier creatures the zerg will not be able to defeat. Maybe if the zerg are led by the dark voice. But that’s an entirely different thing.
Which is what I mean previously when I said the zerg would have no counter to the magic. I didn’t mean magic entirely so much as the highest tier magic in wc3.
If I were to scrap the Titans, how would this play out?
The titans stomp the zerg, of course. I don’t think they should be included.
=
I seriously doubt that zerg can beat the Ancients and demigods of Azeroth, however. The mortal races, sure. Goodbye gnomes. In the end though, they are only a vast swarm of alien supercreatures. They’re not beating Ragnaros or the other Elemental Lords, they’ll die by the thousands to the Dragon Aspects, and the forces of the Lich King will grow with every individual they manage to bring down.
=
And the dark fires of the Burning Legion will find only joy in the slaughter. They have necromancy of their own aplenty, innumerable demons possessing enchanted and poisoned blades, and high-class tactical capabilities. And what will the zerg do when Lord Kil’Jaeden the Deceiver turns them against one another with enchanted deception?
“They’re not beating Ragnaros or the other Elemental Lords,”
-
Bit of a No-Limits-Fallacy. Just because they are made of an element doesn’t mean they can’t be disrupted or destroyed.
-
“they’ll die by the thousands to the Dragon Aspects”
-
Thousands mean nothing to the Zerg.
-
“and the forces of the Lich King will grow with every individual they manage to bring down.”
-
Which will then be destroyed again. Millions of zerg >> thousands of undead. Tell me again why the Zerg can’t just fly into the Lich King’s face and kill him?
-
“And what will the zerg do when Lord Kil’Jaeden the Deceiver turns them against one another with enchanted deception?”
-
Considering they don’t think for themselves… not much.
-
“enchanted and poisoned blades,”
-
Great. The scale of the Zerg counteracts this.
-
” innumerable demons”
-
Honestly, this is the only thing that can beat the Zerg besides the Titans, if we know how many there are. “Innumerable” can mean different things for different people.
“Bit of a No-Limits-Fallacy. Just because they are made of an element doesn’t mean they can’t be disrupted or destroyed.”
-That is not what I was implying.
=
“Thousands mean nothing to the Zerg.”
Thousands means thousands. It’s the rate that defines it, and I’d wager the rate of five Dragon Aspects to be rather high.
=
“Which will then be destroyed again. Millions of zerg >> thousands of undead.”
-Undead can be risen again. Undead zerg are greater than living zerg by default, and thus undeath will slowly steal over their race. It’s the same principle as with any other race fighting them.
=
“Tell me again why the Zerg can’t just fly into the Lich King’s face and kill him?”
-They could try, of course. The problem is all of his minions, and his own vast powers.
=
“Considering they don’t think for themselves… not much.”
-Alright.
=
“Great. The scale of the Zerg counteracts this.”
-The point I was making is that the demon blades would be able to pierce the zerg with ease. I’d post a quote, but I don’t currently have the books.
=
“Honestly, this is the only thing that can beat the Zerg besides the Titans, if we know how many there are. “Innumerable” can mean different things for different people.”
-”The Nether, an ethereal dimension of chaotic magics that connected the myriad worlds of the universe together, was home to an infinite number of malefic, demonic beings, who sought only to destroy life and devour the energies of the living universe.” -Warcraft III: Reign of Chaos manual, page 77.
=
Now tell me, exactly how many zerg are there? Because considering there are millions of capable warriors on Azeroth, not even taking into account demigods and magics, I don’t know how much the forces of the Twisting Nether would need to become involved.
“-”The Nether, an ethereal dimension of chaotic magics that connected the myriad worlds of the universe together, was home to an infinite number of malefic, demonic beings, who sought only to destroy life and devour the energies of the living universe.” -Warcraft III: Reign of Chaos manual, page 77.”
-
Well dang.
So….. Someone was saying the BL doesn’t even number in the trillions? After the evidence posted, this has probably been cleared up. The BL solo.
Also, the Elemental Lords CAN die. But the Zerg just don’t have the right powers for it.
“So….. Someone was saying the BL doesn’t even number in the trillions? After the evidence posted, this has probably been cleared up.”
-Not that it matters, but that quote was talking about the demons of the Twisting Nether, not all of which are members of the Burning Legion. Not all, but…
“Almost all demons are members of the Burning Legion, a group of phenomenal power that roams the cosmos preying on worlds.” -Monster Guide, page 189.
=
Didn’t mean to be confusing. But most of infinity is quite a lot, wouldn’t you say?
=
“Also, the Elemental Lords CAN die. But the Zerg just don’t have the right powers for it.”
-I would think so, considering it has always taken magic to beat them. I was thinking though, how would the zerg do anything but die to Ragnaros, a giant of flame? How could they at all effect Neptulon, who swims freely in the ocean? The Aspects have much more of a chance of being killed, I admit.
The only ‘magic’ that the Zerg have are Kerrigan’s Psionics.
Would be good to see her and Kil’Jaeden in a battle of wills.
“The only ‘magic’ that the Zerg have are Kerrigan’s Psionics.
Would be good to see her and Kil’Jaeden in a battle of wills.”
-
She would most likely lose.
Kerrigan vs Kil’Jaeden…of course Kil’Jaeden wins..
but how about Kerrigan vs a paladin who mastered whole divine spells? Seriously, is there anything which can penetrate divine shield of Warcraft 3?
As far as divine shields in WoW go, it’s obviously game mechanics. Same for Warcraft III. The point is though, they are very powerful shields, and there are very few beings that can penetrate them. Tyrande was protected by such a shield of Elune in the War of the Ancients trilogy, which proved unbreakable to even Archimonde, if I remember correctly.
@ everyone: elemental creatures are what exactly (physically)? if they are resilient to physical damage, would psyionic attacks of the sort kerrigan can do work against them? for that matter, would the weaker psyionic attacks of the queens worknto counter-act images?
@Lieutenant Nerazim
Where the Tartarus were you?
@ commander: … I still have two and a half weeks of exams left, actually…
@ everyone: on the note of numbers, am I right in assuming we are using game production times? ’cause if so, I believe the serge would deffinately over whelm the warcrwft team in numbers… it takes a fewnseconds to mutate a zergling from larvae (im assuming this time is realistic due to comparisson of the time it takes units to cross map areas and the relative sizenof the units) and since each mutation gives two zerglings (it does right? i havent played in a while), and each hive has three larvae, the zerg team can produce six zerglings per hive in seconds. are there any production rates of the basic fighting units from the warcraft world that are comparable in terms of magnitude and speed? (i havent played warcraft in longer…)
@Lieutenant
What.
The.
HELLS????
I thought those exams are gone, already!
So in the main fighting, how many armies will both sides send at each other?
@Nerazim
No. Those are game mechanics.
-
Physical attacks won’t work against the Elemental Lords since they’re made out of intangible stuff. Kerrigan’s attack might work but the Titans, Sargeras, Old Gods, Kil-Jaeden would destroy her in a mind battle.
@Lightning
You know quite a bit on both sides, wouldn’t you agree?
@CC
Quite. I like Blizzard’s games and recently got Diablo 3 since my friend bought it and we share an account. I’ll start playing after my exams.
@Lightning
If its consented, may I speak with you via the P.Ms about something?
www.factpile.com/6671-annabeth-chase-vs-clary-fray/
Also, mind dropping by in this match as well?
@ lightning: can u clear up please? what exactly are you categorizing as game mechanics? the training times? *shrug* j havent started to read the books… i was gonna get them, but them i cant read them for the same reason both of are not playing diablo 3 (exams)
@ commander: j do more than the required eight subjects, and because i do sciences and math subjects i have three exams each for most.
@ Nerazim
The Burning Legion, and Warcraft demons in general, outnumber the Zerg infinity to one.
-
Summer’s almost over here, and I’m about to enter the most difficult year in college, the *classified* year.
@Nerazim
The training times yeah. Gameplay doesn’t work since there’s game mechanics there.
-
What country are you from?
@Lieutenant Nerazim + Lightning
Yikes!(on the irratating exam excesses!)
What parts of the Zerg having gameplay mechanics is being discussed thus far?
@ hermit: summer just ended? … smh the seasons on earth are messed up… then again, what can i say? we live here.
@ lightning: trinidad (caribbean)
@ commander: … only production speednso far, i think.
*screams out loud* argh! blasted touchscrenz!!!!
@ Nerazim
I live in the tropics.
-
I wish this could be awarded, but the inclusion of the infinite demons from the Nether makes this kind of a stomp.
@ hermit: maybe the ‘infinite’ demons should be allowed to help in a limited manner… akelz7?
… you hav summer in the tropics? *mutters to self* this world realy is messed up…
We can limit “vs Universe” battles all we want, but that kind of breaks the point.Against the Warcraft Universe minus demons… well, I personally just think that would be a dumb restriction, though I can see the reasoning. Even so, the Titans would trash the zerg.
=
If it is to be the zerg vs Azeroth only, my support is still with Azeroth. Why? For the same reason Matapiojo said the tauren would beat the Na’vi. Warcraft has intangibles.
=
I don’t mean elementals, because they aren’t actually intangible. However, Malfurion Stormrage was able to cast magic whilst invisible and untouchable by way of the Emerald Dream. If I need to find the quote for this, I will. Walkers of The Dream would be virtually invincible if the face of a zerg invasion.
=
And there’s still the fact that every zerg that dies, which will be many, would be a wonderful target for necromancy. Lich King and the Val’kyr make a dent in the alien armies, and suddenly that dent doubles. And then it doubles again. And again. So on, so forth. Red dragons are capable of raising the dead as well.
=
Food for thought.
I’m trying to understand why you are all assuming the zerg would land on the surface of azeroth to begin the killing. I see it as just as possible that they would send no more than a few units to spread an infestation virus, which we know the zerg had by the time WOL started. Thus everything humanoid and not undead shall become zerg. Bye bye night elves, orcs, humans, blood elves, tauren, pandareans, trolls, etc. Also, it is open to debate whether or not death knights could find themsleves infested, I would say.
_
The thing about the zerg using an infestation virus is that it will infest all kinds of biological things. Furthermore, if zerg can get their hands on the right DNA, there is no reason they could not grow some warlocks of their own. Could they make things to match the titans? No. Do they need them? No. With everything living turning into zerg, they would have plenty of troops to win the war of attrition.
“I see it as just as possible that they would send no more than a few units to spread an infestation virus, which we know the zerg had by the time WOL started.”
-That would be an excuse for the Lich King to kill and raise as undead those that were his former allies for this fight.
~
“Bye bye night elves, orcs, humans, blood elves, tauren, pandareans, trolls, etc.”
-But not elementals, of which there are many. Infested races would also more than likely slay those of their kind who are transforming. And later they’d be raised into undeath.
~
“Also, it is open to debate whether or not death knights could find themsleves infested, I would say.”
-Only if the virus affects dead guys.
~
“Furthermore, if zerg can get their hands on the right DNA, there is no reason they could not grow some warlocks of their own.”
-I can think of one. Warlocks are not a biological occurrence. They don’t grow to have warlock powers. They have to learn them, just like any mage, shaman, or druid. Just like you learn to fight.
~
“With everything living turning into zerg, they would have plenty of troops to win the war of attrition.”
-A war of attrition will always be won by the Scourge. Every zerg that falls will be raised, fallen undead will be re-raised, and the magical plague will infect still-living zerg. Attrition was how the nerubians were defeated when the Scourge was still new and small.
~
And… this is still ignoring the endless demons of the Burning Legion and Twisting Nether. Infernals and Voidwalkers can certainly not be infested.
So…what’s taking that FP award so long?
I doubt anyone has been asking for this to get an award.
You know, looking over this fight, I still think the Zerg would be able to take over Azeroth. Maybe not the Burning Legions (I’ll get to that later), but sheer numbers would take out almost everything.
-
You mention intangibles. How many are there, and what are their magics like? This is very, very important, because if there aren’t many intangibles, then their un-touchability won’t matter in the grand scheme of things. To give you a sense of scale, if one of them killed one Zerg every second, it would take more than 31 years to kill one billion of them.
-
You also mention how the Zerg will be turned to undead. I must question the mechanics of this. If I remember correctly, someone must come in after an engagement and raise the undead. This implies that the Zerg will actually lose an engagement, which they won’t. Even if I am mis-remembering how the Undead are raised, the Zerg can just eat all of the corpses. Really solves that problem.
-
The Burning Legion? I feel like their numbers were ever effectively proven.
*never effectively proven.
-
Really important “n” there.
Zerg pre-SC2 are pretty wimpy. They still have very capable FTL though, and infection can be spread through spores.
-
“A war of attrition will always be won by the Scourge. Every zerg that falls will be raised, fallen undead will be re-raised, and the magical plague will infect still-living zerg. ”
-
How would it even get to the Zerg? Isn’t it fungal?
-
On a side note, the match description doesn’t need to give Zerg 100 years worth or resources, as they are pretty self-sufficient in that regard. Creep serves as nourishment.
“The Burning Legion? I feel like their numbers were never effectively proven.”
-No, and I don’t think it can be. I only proved the amount of demons in general is infinite.
~
“You know, looking over this fight, I still think the Zerg would be able to take over Azeroth.”
-Azeroth’s chances are decidedly slim, but it does have some noteworthy unique elements. How many billions of Zerg are there? They will be attacking all the planets throughout the Warcraft universe, so only a fraction of them will be descending on Azeroth at any one time.
~
“You mention intangibles. How many are there, and what are their magics like?”
-Any druid or green dragon can walk the Emerald Dream, at which point they can fly, are both intangible and invisible, and are free to use their magic as they normally do. Here’s a convenient quote:
~
“In the past, Malfurion had used the training he had received from his mentor—the demigod, Cenarius—to walk a realm called the Emerald Dream. The Emerald Dream was a place where the world looked as it would have had there been neither civilization or even animal life. Through it, one’s dream form could quickly reach locations all across the world. It had enabled him to pass through the magical barriers surrounding Queen Azshara’s citadel and spy upon her Highborne and the commanders of the Burning Legion. He had used it to disrupt the plans of Xavius, the queen’s counselor, and, after a harrowing imprisonment, temporarily destroy the portal and the tower containing it.” -The War of the Ancients: The Sundering, page 6.
~
Of course, their bodies do have to go somewhere while they do that. The easy solution is the Emerald Dream itself can be physically entered. There is much proof for that, but I think this will suffice:
~
“The key to their hopes of reaching Malfurion, the reason for seeking this place, was this portal. The physical path to the Emerald Dream and the Nightmare—the only path that might still be at all trustworthy—lay open to them.” -Stormrage, page 233.
~
The other paths eluded to, the ones said not to be safe, are three in number and guarded by green dragons. The portals can be closed, of course. The Emerald Dream would make a wonderful safe haven.
~
“If I remember correctly, someone must come in after an engagement and raise the undead.”
-That’s one way. I had also been counting on the Plague of Undeath, which is magical in nature and transforms infected beings into members of the Scourge. However, this only affects humans in particular, and merely kills most, but not all, other living things. So you can forget that. I don’t know how long it takes to alter it to affect other life forms.
~
“This implies that the Zerg will actually lose an engagement, which they won’t.”
-If this is the zerg that died to farm equipment and being hit by a vehicle as seen in this video, they will be losing some engagements. The Scourge has members like Thrym and Sindragosa.
~
“Zerg can just eat all of the corpses. Really solves that problem.”
-The Scourge’s necromancers don’t have to wait to raise the bodies. Once they figure out the zerg like to consume corpses, they will take extra care to not give them the chance.
~
“How would it even get to the Zerg? Isn’t it fungal?”
-No, it isn’t fungal. But, what I said to Aelfinn.
~
Can zerg operate well in water? Because there are powerful beings in Azeroth’s oceans. Elementals also cannot be killed on the mortal plane, only be banished back to their elemental plane.
~
Yet in the end, the numbers of the zerg would overwhelm and kill all opposing biological life and the Scourge as well. Only those in the Emerald Dream, a realm the zerg cannot enter, would remain untouched. From there and with time, Azeroth’s inhabitants could launch an unlimited number of attacks with no fear of harm. They could never fully eradicate the zerg, though. So the latter could basically occupy Azeroth to their contentment provided they are willing to tolerate the “Zerg Hunters” that would doubtless become common, I’ll give you that.
~
This could make a good fanfic.
~
Fortunately, the whole Warcraft universe is intent on conquering the zerg.